If you mean upgrades over Bernie and Bubba, there are plenty, to name a few, Granderson, Patterson, Gathright, Bradley, Jones, Davanon, and Michaels probably still can be gotten to...Originally Posted by JeterRodriguezSheff
If you mean upgrades over Bernie and Bubba, there are plenty, to name a few, Granderson, Patterson, Gathright, Bradley, Jones, Davanon, and Michaels probably still can be gotten to...
Calmer than you are.
Dodgers Contact Yankees About Pavano
http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-...adlines-sports
"Long Island is New Jersey with a GED." - Triumph the Insult Comic Dog.
Jonathan Broxton plus Dioner Navarro for Pavano and cash!
If Dodgers thinks the price is too high, Dioner plus Chuck Tiffany is OK.
i would do pavano for navarro and any outfielder besides jd drewJonathan Broxton plus Dioner Navarro for Pavano and cash!
If Dodgers thinks the price is too high, Dioner plus Chuck Tiffany is OK.
sounds reasonable, especially with their glut of catching prospects
actually, i really wouldn't mind doing pavano for navarro straight up
I would think we could get more for CP.
"Long Island is New Jersey with a GED." - Triumph the Insult Comic Dog.
it's not up to me to decide his value. but all i'm saying is that i really wouldn't mind a pavano for navarro swap.
Not enough in return. Even if the Dodogers pick up the whole remaining contract.
agreed. with the prospects they have I would hope we could get a stud.
"Long Island is New Jersey with a GED." - Triumph the Insult Comic Dog.
http://www.nynewsday.com/sports/base...orts-headlinesThe Yankees and Mets already are two of baseball's biggest winners this offseason. But there's a bit of business left. Nothing might happen on this front until spring training, if then, but the Mets still are looking to trade Kaz Matsui and the Yankees haven't abandoned the idea of dealing Carl Pavano...
...When the Yankees publicly have said they'd like to keep Pavano, that's just them negotiating. They know he'd do better elsewhere.
~John
I can see trading Pavano, but certainly not for Matsui. I hope that isn't what the reporter was pointing to. I like the idea of a C prospect much more.
That little blurb in that articale in no way lived up to the headline. Maybe if the writer found some way to put the Yankees in the title he thought someone would actually give a ................ about it. That was a waste of time.
The loser now will be later to win...
Trading Pavano would be a really smart move. Cashman if he is in control will get rid of him, I think he is just driving up his value, if we can get Granderson for Pavano, we should do it...
Calmer than you are.
Detroit is not trading Granderson!
Newsday has been trying to run Pavano out of town since last summer.
Though Matsui would get us closer to the all SS team
You've got nothing to believe in but believing in yourself.
No, I think he was just saying that the Yankees might trade Pavano AND the Mets are shopping Matsui.
Net result of this deal if made.....Pavano, Halsey and Vazquez a cash for RJ....while the idea of having Navaro back is tempting, I'd like to give Pavano one more year with him healthy and out from under Mel....
That wasn't the suggestion, just that the Yanks and Mets would both like to trade the players away, not to each other.
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Mel wasn't the cause of Pavano's problems.
The best case scenario for the Yankees is that they keep Pavano and he rewards them with a healthy, productive year, thus reestablishing his trade value if they decide to move him next off-season.
Why trade something when their value is absolutely zilch? Let's see if Guidry and Kerrigan can do something with him before we paint the "he's not a New York player" on his forehead. If those two can't cut it, reunite him with Alyssa Milano.
Injuries wre probably the main cause,I'm just saying he has a clean bill of health AND a new coach...he comes back next year with a clean slate...
No where in the article did he proposed Pavano for Matsui or even suggest it.
Didn't you get the memo? Mel was the cause of all things bad on the pitching staff the last ten seasons and had absolutely nothing to do with any of the successes of the staff during that time.
I heard Mel took a tire iron to Mussina's elbow.
I also heard it was Mel in disguise who hit that ball off of Wright's elbow.
Mel also liked to coat the bullpen rubber with Vaseline, hoping that one of his pitchers would break an ankle.
So, what you are saying is that the writers at Newsday have a vendetta against Carl Pavano and have decided to make up rumors that the Yankees will trade him and that he doesn't like it here. These writers have decided instead of doing their job, they will make lies up about Pavano... My guess is there is some truth behind it. I think one of our pitchers will be traded late in the offseason.
“I mean, people knew that Brown was out there, and that Randy was ornery all the time. And Pavano is whoever he is. But if you’re their manager, you can’t go out and write about them like that.”
No he was not. Nor did he help Pavano's problems. Nor did he help Wright's. Nor did he help Javy's. Nor RJ's.
“I mean, people knew that Brown was out there, and that Randy was ornery all the time. And Pavano is whoever he is. But if you’re their manager, you can’t go out and write about them like that.”
Keep Pavano, trade Wright for anything.
Jaret Wright wouldn't get us a can of Tomato Soup.
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Yeah, yeah, we heard that before. He's gone now so you'll need a new whipping boy. I forgot you still have Pavano then again, Torre is still a favorite target of yours.
Their vendetta is almost as deep as yours is for Pavano.
I wouldn't call it a vendetta. It's just the media doing what the media does. Newsday ran an unsourced claim about Pavano supposedly disliking it here. So now it's that paper's job to back up its own stories whenever referring to Pavano. Common practice. If nothing happens with Pavano, then of course the earlier piece will never be referenced again. If he's traded, it becomes "see, we told you so".
JWF is not unlike a lot of fans here - he believes the sports media when it suits his own purposes and ignores them when it doesn't.
Its not that he isnt a NY player. He just sucks. Look at his career numbers and you would find 2004 to be an abberation.
Interestingly, the inflated FA market has made Carl look like a decent value. Even if he never regains his 2004 form, a healthy Pavano can eat some innings (which translated means, "make alot of mediocre starts"). These days, that appears to be worth about 10mil per.
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I was just stating a fact. Yep, Pavano and Torre are still here for me except I'm hopeful that Pavano will pitch well (if he's still a Yankee) and Torre will manage better.
“I mean, people knew that Brown was out there, and that Randy was ornery all the time. And Pavano is whoever he is. But if you’re their manager, you can’t go out and write about them like that.”
That's just incorrect. I have no vendetta against Pavano. I just think that 1. He's not that good of a pitcher, 2. He could have pitched through injury last year and 3. He would rather not be a Yankee.
“I mean, people knew that Brown was out there, and that Randy was ornery all the time. And Pavano is whoever he is. But if you’re their manager, you can’t go out and write about them like that.”
Just an FYI, it wasn't just Newsday. It was a number of media outlets.
“I mean, people knew that Brown was out there, and that Randy was ornery all the time. And Pavano is whoever he is. But if you’re their manager, you can’t go out and write about them like that.”
We've been through this before - you claimed "numerous" media outlets had discussed Pavano's supposed unhappiness and it turned out to be two or so. One of which was Newsday discussing its own previous articles.
I know the Ledger also reported this. So did ESPN, although, to be fair, they were probably getting it from the Ledger or Newsday. Paul Quantrill also said this. So did AJ Burnett.
“I mean, people knew that Brown was out there, and that Randy was ornery all the time. And Pavano is whoever he is. But if you’re their manager, you can’t go out and write about them like that.”
Show links to all of the above with stories wherein they state Pavano isn't happy here.
Or would you prefer to first nuance what it is you'd like to claim they said and then link to the stories? I'll leave it up to you.
I'd prefer to first nuance what I'd claim and then link the stories. Much prefer actually - it's a pain to find these stories. But, since you are such a dear friend, here you go:
http://www.nj.com/yankees/ledger/ind...480.xml&coll=1
Right-hander Carl Pavano, who signed a four-year contract with the Yankees a year ago, has been telling friends he wants out.
A person who spoke with Pavano late in the 2005 season said Pavano was "miserable" with the Yankees and that he would like the team to try to trade him this winter. He has not yet asked the Yankees to trade him, and he might not make the request formal, but he might not have to.
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/marlins...otes_0910.html
Can't find the Burnett one, but it was posted here somewhere."He found it to be a bit of a cold place," said Quantrill, who pitched with Pavano earlier this year. "They're just a bunch of professionals. You show up, you go home. No friends.''
“I mean, people knew that Brown was out there, and that Randy was ornery all the time. And Pavano is whoever he is. But if you’re their manager, you can’t go out and write about them like that.”
So once again "numerous" becomes "two". I think you should go back to agonizing over Damon leading off - it sounds like a much more promising meme for you this year than banging the Pavano drum again. OR you can call him a "wimp" three or four more times. That worked out well for you.
That's your problem, you mistakenly think your stated opinion as fact.
Its also Mel's fault that Vazquez sucked in Arizona and that Weaver is so mediocre in LA.
I don't know if "He's not a New York Player"
I think its more of "He's not a good player"
You could even parse it down to, "He's not a healthy player". He had had elbow or shoulder problems in 1997, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, and 2005 and those problems have hindered his performance and/or IP in each of those seasons. This has nothing to do with Mel or 'being able to play in NY' or whether or not he dogged it last year. To me, that's all irrelevant. What is relevant is that he is very, very likely to be hurt again, and when he's hurt, he either doesn't pitch at all or doesn't pitch well. Knowing that, if I can trade him for something right now, before he gets hurt again and has no value, I think I have to. There's a market for him, so take advantage of it before it dries up completely.
Just noticed that, eh?
In my opinion, if the Yanks were going to trade Pavano, they would have signed a free agent starter to replace him, such as a Jarod Washburn or one of the other mediocre starters that were available. They have too many question marks with each of their starters to be trading Pavano and not getting at least a bonafide #3 or #4 starter back in return. Since that doesn't seem likely, I think Pavano will be counted on to rebound this year as a New York Yankee.
Right now we have:
1) RJ
2.) Mussina
3.) Wang
4.) Chacon
5.) Pavano
6.) Wright
So even trading Pavano still gives us 5 starters. Taking it a step further and keeping in mind I'm not advocating it, nor do I think it will happen, but what if we signed Clemens? Or between now and March make a trade? As things are, I agree that Pavano isn't going anywhere, nor would I until mid ST at the earliest, but things may be going on that we are not aware of.
NEW link for NYYFANS companion site for politics and more: www.editorialme.com.
Wright/Small would make fine 5th starters if Pavano is traded especially with this offense...
Calmer than you are.
5 starters who most folks think are susceptible to either injury or a sub-par performance, or even both. Trading Pavano makes no sense unless they get a similar starter in return -- they can't afford the chance of losing one of the remaining 5 and replacing him with the likes of an Aaron Small or a Sean Henn or a Jorge DePaula, who are all inferior to a healthy Pavano.
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