The Official Patriots Analysis Thread

[RIyankee]

I think the Pats want Troy Brown back next season but at their price. He's more valuable to this organization becaue RIREDSOXFAN hit the nail on the head when he mentioned what a great role model he has been for this team over the years. Brown is one of the greatest 8th picks of all time. I hope he comes back in 2005.

[cubswin]

Originally posted by RIREDSOXFAN
I love having ALL the players on this team. How can you not love Troy Brown? He's been my favorite player for years, and he's such a good example for kids. I have a son who is almost 12, tall kid, but with zero confidence athletically. He's a great student, has a lot of confidence in school, but none playing sports.
He's playing basketball this year (like I said, he IS tall,), but he's so afraid he's not good enough. It shows, because he plays afraid.
I know alot of people don't like the Patriots, but when you look at that team, there are alot of guys who were told they weren't good enough. One of the announcers was talking about that last night. Some of the Patriots best players were drafted low, cut by other teams, etc.
I show my son Troy Brown, who was drafted I believe 8th round, then cut, and brought back by the Patriots (thank God!). I can tell my son that nothing is beyond your grasp if you are willing to WORK for it.
My son will never be a pro athlete, but he can at least try, and have fun playing.
Athletes can be role models, and there are athletes out there who make great role models. Troy Brown is one of them.
Last week, when Troy was playing on defense, the announcers were talking about him and they relayed a conversation between Belichick and Brown. The subject was playing defense, and if he was ready and could do it. Troy basically said- "I'm a football player, it's football season, so I'll play football wherever you tell me to play". How can you not find that refreshing compared to the attitudes and antics of too many pro athletes.
Sorry to get wordy, but I just had to write this about Troy Brown. I don't have any idea how the season will turn about, but for me this Patriots team is so easy to love!

totally agree

[son of mel hall]

Originally posted by RIREDSOXFAN
I love having ALL the players on this team. How can you not love Troy Brown? He's been my favorite player for years, and he's such a good example for kids. I have a son who is almost 12, tall kid, but with zero confidence athletically. He's a great student, has a lot of confidence in school, but none playing sports.
He's playing basketball this year (like I said, he IS tall,), but he's so afraid he's not good enough. It shows, because he plays afraid.
I know alot of people don't like the Patriots, but when you look at that team, there are alot of guys who were told they weren't good enough. One of the announcers was talking about that last night. Some of the Patriots best players were drafted low, cut by other teams, etc.
I show my son Troy Brown, who was drafted I believe 8th round, then cut, and brought back by the Patriots (thank God!). I can tell my son that nothing is beyond your grasp if you are willing to WORK for it.
My son will never be a pro athlete, but he can at least try, and have fun playing.
Athletes can be role models, and there are athletes out there who make great role models. Troy Brown is one of them.
Last week, when Troy was playing on defense, the announcers were talking about him and they relayed a conversation between Belichick and Brown. The subject was playing defense, and if he was ready and could do it. Troy basically said- "I'm a football player, it's football season, so I'll play football wherever you tell me to play". How can you not find that refreshing compared to the attitudes and antics of too many pro athletes.
Sorry to get wordy, but I just had to write this about Troy Brown. I don't have any idea how the season will turn about, but for me this Patriots team is so easy to love!

I'm completely on board with this. I couldn't stay up through the whole game, but I nearly flipped my lip when brown picked off bledsoe. Last night's win was very impressive. Pats could easily go 14-2 this year, thanks in no small measure to selfless players like Brown.

[RIREDSOXFAN]

Originally posted by RIyankee
I think the Pats want Troy Brown back next season but at their price. He's more valuable to this organization becaue RIREDSOXFAN hit the nail on the head when he mentioned what a great role model he has been for this team over the years. Brown is one of the greatest 8th picks of all time. I hope he comes back in 2005.

I'm reasonably sure he was signed before this season to a multi-year contract that will take him to the end of his career, as a New England Patriot. I can't remember the details off-hand, but I remember thinking when I heard them I was pleased, because based upon the commentary I heard it sounded like this was the last contract he would sign and it would take him to the end of his playing career.
He is a player who should never wear another teams uniform.

On a sadder note, I felt very badly for Drew Bledsoe last night. I always liked him and think he is a stand-up guy. I'll admit that when they traded him I was very upset, and I thought they chose the wrong QB. It has taken me a long time to warm up to Tom Brady, part of the reason being I did not like how the Patriots handled the QB situation.
It's very fashionable now to have laughs at Drew's expense (although even WEEI talking heads today were not as brutal as usual), but let's remember how awful the Patriots were before Drew came to NE. He's part of the reason the Pats play in such a beautiful stadium today. If not for the ownership change to Bob Kraft, the prior owner signing Bill Parcells to coach before Kraft bought the team, and then Bledsoe being drafted by Parcells with the #1 pick, how likely do you think the Patriots would even still be in New England today, let alone one of the top organizations in all of sports.

If the Patriots can't win the Super Bowl every year (that was a joke), I would be thrilled to see Drew lead his team to victory. Maybe he will end up in a better situation for him next year. As someone said earlier, remember what happened to Jim Plunkett after he escaped from NE all those years ago.

[cubswin]

Originally posted by RIREDSOXFAN


...
He is a player who should never wear another teams uniform.

On a sadder note, I felt very badly for Drew Bledsoe last night. I always liked him and think he is a stand-up guy. I'll admit that when they traded him I was very upset, and I thought they chose the wrong QB. It has taken me a long time to warm up to Tom Brady, part of the reason being I did not like how the Patriots handled the QB situation.
It's very fashionable now to have laughs at Drew's expense (although even WEEI talking heads today were not as brutal as usual), but let's remember how awful the Patriots were before Drew came to NE. He's part of the reason the Pats play in such a beautiful stadium today. If not for the ownership change to Bob Kraft, the prior owner signing Bill Parcells to coach before Kraft bought the team, and then Bledsoe being drafted by Parcells with the #1 pick, how likely do you think the Patriots would even still be in New England today, let alone one of the top organizations in all of sports.

If the Patriots can't win the Super Bowl every year (that was a joke), I would be thrilled to see Drew lead his team to victory. Maybe he will end up in a better situation for him next year. As someone said earlier, remember what happened to Jim Plunkett after he escaped from NE all those years ago.

and again, totally agree

I am very glad to admit that I was very wrong re. Brady v. Bledsoe. Very glad.

[son of mel hall]

I always admired Bledsoe personally, but I kind of soured on his performance his last couple years with the pats. He was just plain immobile. It's not like Brady is Fran Tarkenton, but he doesn't stand there like a fence post either. I was pleased with the decision to trade Bledsoe.

[WebsterMulligan]

The addition of Corey Dillon has elevated the Patriots to juggernaut status, IMO. The simple fact that they continue to crush the opposition, despite injuries, is a clear indication that they are one of the best teams in the NFL. Possibly the best. The Patriot's offensive line is underrated and has been clearly over-looked. They were opening gaping holes for Dillon, as well as giving Brady ample time to find his receivers downfield. The O-line was spectacular, last night.

As far as Bledsoe is concerned, he is no longer the great QB, he once was. He is no longer even a good QB. I would'nt be surprised if he ends up relegated to a backup role, for next week's game.

[son of mel hall]

Originally posted by WebsterMulligan
The addition of Corey Dillon has elevated the Patriots to juggernaut status, IMO. The simple fact that they continue to crush the opposition, despite injuries, is a clear indication that they are one of the best teams in the NFL. Possibly the best. The Patriot's offensive line is underrated and has been clearly over-looked. They were opening gaping holes for Dillon, as well as giving Brady ample time to find his receivers downfield. The O-line was spectacular, last night.

As far as Bledsoe is concerned, he is no longer the great QB, he once was. He is no longer even a good QB. I would'nt be surprised if he ends up relegated to a backup role, for next week's game.

Dillon is even better than most people around here expected. Your point about the offensive line is well taken as well.

I really can't say enough about the pats. They are not the most talented group, but they are the most resourceful and flexible and well-coached.

[WebsterMulligan]

Originally posted by son of mel hall


I really can't say enough about the pats. They are not the most talented group, but they are the most resourceful and flexible and well-coached.

100% Agreed. Just look at their lineup. Other than Brady perhaps, you will be hard-pressed to find many superstars on that team. Coaching is the main factor which separates the Pat's, from the rest of the NFL.

[son of mel hall]

Originally posted by WebsterMulligan


100% Agreed. Just look at their lineup. Other than Brady perhaps, you will be hard-pressed to find many superstars on that team. Coaching is the main factor which separates the Pat's, from the rest of the NFL.

A good topic for a thread might be who's the better coach, Parcells or Belichick. I don't think anyone would argue that Belichick has not come out from under Parcells' shadow.

[WebsterMulligan]

Originally posted by son of mel hall


A good topic for a thread might be who's the better coach, Parcells or Belichick. I don't think anyone would argue that Belichick has not come out from under Parcells' shadow.

Belichick is the better coach, hands down.

[RIyankee]

On the sbuject of Pats WRs...

I'm 99% sure that Troy Brown is in the final year of his contract. That multi-year deal was a 3-year deal through 2002-2004. IMO the Pats will offer him a near minimum deal w/ incentives.

OTOH, I don't see David Patten returning. Like Brown, Patten is in the final year of his contract.

David Givens will be a restricted FA in February. The Pats will have a tough time signing him. His negotiational position gets stronger every game. He's the only big, physical WR they have. It's likely the team will tender him at the 1st rounder level. That will keep in in the fold for 2005.

With Deion Branch, Bethel Johnson, and P.K. Sam returning. I don't see the Pats going after a wideout unless they lose Givens.

Sam should have stayed in school. He clearly wasn't ready for the NFL (physically). Hopefully a year in the team's offseason weight training program will do him good. The Pats signed him for 5 years so Sam will have plenty of opportunities to succeed.

[hugelongtermdeal]

Originally posted by WebsterMulligan


Belichick is the better coach, hands down.

Also, he's not the pompous a-hole that Parcell's is either - which is nice.

[son of mel hall]

Originally posted by WebsterMulligan


Belichick is the better coach, hands down.

Sure he is now, but how about over the span of their careers?

[WebsterMulligan]

Originally posted by son of mel hall


Sure he is now, but how about over the span of their careers?

I'd still give the nod to Belichick. Parcells has never won a championship without Belichick, his defensive coordinator, for the Giant's two Superbowl teams. I'm not taking anything away from Parcells, a future HOF coach.

[RIyankee]

Patriots (8-1) at Chiefs (3-6)

Monday Night Football

Thoughts?

[NYPenn]

Latest report on the Chiefs says Priest Holmes will sit out Monday night with an injury.

I'd say it's looking pretty good for New England.

[RIyankee]

Originally posted by NYPenn
Latest report on the Chiefs says Priest Holmes will sit out Monday night with an injury.

I'd say it's looking pretty good for New England.

Blaylock racked up 186 rushing yards aganist NO. But I agree with you that it does look good for the Pats.

The Chiefs WRs don't scare me. Sure they're fast, but not big. It's the big, physical WRs that have given the Pats trouble.

TE Tony Gonzalez will be trouble for the older, slower Pats LBs.

The Chiefs O-Line is one of the NFL's best. The last time the Pats "D" went up against a top-notch O-line was at Pittsburgh and we all know how that turned out.

If the Pats avoid turnovers, they will win this game easily - this is a recording.

[RIREDSOXFAN]

Originally posted by RIyankee
On the sbuject of Pats WRs...

I'm 99% sure that Troy Brown is in the final year of his contract. That multi-year deal was a 3-year deal through 2002-2004. IMO the Pats will offer him a near minimum deal w/ incentives.

Troy was signed last year to a multi-year extension that will bring him to the end of his playing days (hopefully) still wearing a Patriot uniform.

[son of mel hall]

Originally posted by RIyankee


Blaylock racked up 186 rushing yards aganist NO. But I agree with you that it does look good for the Pats.

The Chiefs WRs don't scare me. Sure they're fast, but not big. It's the big, physical WRs that have given the Pats trouble.

TE Tony Gonzalez will be trouble for the older, slower Pats LBs.

The Chiefs O-Line is one of the NFL's best. The last time the Pats "D" went up against a top-notch O-line was at Pittsburgh and we all know how that turned out.

If the Pats avoid turnovers, they will win this game easily - this is a recording.

Patriots, 31-20. You heard it here first, folks.

[WebsterMulligan]

Originally posted by RIyankee

If the Pats avoid turnovers, they will win this game easily - this is a recording.

I completely agree. They'll shred the Chief's non-existent defense.

[reelbiggecko]

I don't see this game as much different than the St. Louis game. As long as the Pats secondary can keep KC from getting big gains through the air, they shouldn't present many problems...especially with Priest Holmes doubtful.

[son of mel hall]

Originally posted by WebsterMulligan


I completely agree. They'll shred the Chief's non-existent defense.

what defense?

how you been, web?

[WebsterMulligan]

Originally posted by son of mel hall

how you been, web?

Hola, somh!

[son of mel hall]

Originally posted by WebsterMulligan


Hola, somh!

I'm getting the feeling that some pats fans are getting complacent. I perceive an attitude around here of let's just get to the playoffs already.

[RIyankee]

Originally posted by son of mel hall


I'm getting the feeling that some pats fans are getting complacent. I perceive an attitude around here of let's just get to the playoffs already.

Actually, I'm very concerned about Pittsburgh. If Law and Dillon are healthy, I'm confident they can beat them.

I think if the Pats want to return to the Super Bowl, they must earn a postseason bye. Note their remaining schedule...

Nov 22 @Kansas City 9:00pm
Nov 28 Baltimore 1:00pm
Dec 5 @Cleveland 1:00pm
Dec 12 Cincinnati 1:00pm
Dec 20 @Miami 9:00pm
Dec 26 @N.Y. Jets 4:05pm
Jan 2 San Francisco 1:00pm

IMO...
@KC, @Cleveland, Cincy, and SF are Ws.
The Ravens will be tough and having b-to-b games @NYJ and @Miami, yes Miami, will be a challenge. In truth, I see the Pats finishing no worse than at 13-3 being all but a lock. We have tiebreakers on the Colts and there's no way Denver and SD will go unbeaten. That leaves the question of playing @Pittsburgh or @ Foxboro?

Here's Pittsburgh's remaining schedule...

11/21 - @Cincinnati
11/28 - WASHINGTON
12/5 - @Jacksonville
12/12 - N.Y. JETS
12/18 - @N.Y. Giants (Sat.)
12/26 - BALTIMORE
1/2 - @Buffalo

The Steelers are hard to gauge because they beat the Pats and Eagles at home and neither team had their feature back on the field in those games. However, there's no doubt that the Steelers offense is, by far, the best in the NFL. Big Ben is for real and with Deuce healthy, that running game is very good. That O-line is special too. However, I'm not yet sold on their defense. As the Tuna would say, offense wins games, defense wins championships.

Bottom line: I know what this team is capable of doing and if they can't get one of the two playoff byes, the Pats just would not be good enough to be SB-bound.

[reelbiggecko]

It would be an absolute upset if the Pats don't get a bye, and I'd be very much surprised if they don't get the #1 seed with their remaining schedule. Baltimore is getting hot and I see them as the only real challenge for NE, unless the Jets suddenly rebound, which I don't see happening. The Steelers' schedule isn't that much harder, if any, but I still am not completely sold on them. I see the Pats finishing at 15-1, and the Steelers at 14-2. You heard it here first.

[RIyankee]

Pats fans are we ready for some football!!!

Pats will reach 30 points.

[RIyankee]

ESPN reports Pats NT Kieth Traylor is out with the flu. He won't play tonight.

[reelbiggecko]

Originally posted by RIyankee
ESPN reports Pats NT Kieth Traylor is out with the flu. He won't play tonight.

Their line has had some injury problems for a while now, I wouldn't be worried.

Any predictions for tonight?

I see Corey Dillon ripping apart the Chiefs D for 150 yards and 2 scores, and the Pats taking it in a bit of a shootout, 31-21.

[WebsterMulligan]

Originally posted by reelbiggecko

Any predictions for tonight?

34-17 Pats.

[RIyankee]

That was a big "W" for the Pats. They could run the table now...

Dec 5 @Cleveland 1:00pm
Dec 12 Cincinnati 1:00pm
Dec 20 @Miami 9:00pm
Dec 26 @N.Y. Jets 4:05pm
Jan 2 San Francisco 1:00pm

The Dolphins/Jets back to back will be tough but if the Pats play well, they'll win both.

[FreeYayo]

Originally posted by RIyankee
That was a big "W" for the Pats. They could run the table now...

Dec 5 @Cleveland 1:00pm
Dec 12 Cincinnati 1:00pm
Dec 20 @Miami 9:00pm
Dec 26 @N.Y. Jets 4:05pm
Jan 2 San Francisco 1:00pm

The Dolphins/Jets back to back will be tough but if the Pats play well, they'll win both.

I'm a Bengals fan so I'm looking forward to Dec. 12th
Yes its embarassing
EDIT: And NO im NOT joking

[RIREDSOXFAN]

Originally posted by RIyankee
That was a big "W" for the Pats. They could run the table now...

Dec 5 @Cleveland 1:00pm
Dec 12 Cincinnati 1:00pm
Dec 20 @Miami 9:00pm
Dec 26 @N.Y. Jets 4:05pm
Jan 2 San Francisco 1:00pm

The Dolphins/Jets back to back will be tough but if the Pats play well, they'll win both.

I'm concerned about the Jets game-you gotta give them credit, that team hangs in there even though they lost their QB. How do you think the Pats would do if Brady went down? End of season?

[FreeYayo]

Originally posted by RIREDSOXFAN


I'm concerned about the Jets game-you gotta give them credit, that team hangs in there even though they lost their QB. How do you think the Pats would do if Brady went down? End of season?

Not if Rohan has anything to say about it

[RIyankee]

Originally posted by RIREDSOXFAN


I'm concerned about the Jets game-you gotta give them credit, that team hangs in there even though they lost their QB. How do you think the Pats would do if Brady went down? End of season?

They beat the Browns and Cardinals. They scored only 23 points in both those games. Sure-footed Phil Dawson gagged two makeable FGs. The Pats didn't need Brady to beat the Ravens.

All I'm saying is if the Pats play well against the Jets, they will win.

BTW Brady is better than Pennington and the Pats would miss Brady more than the Jets miss Chad.

[RIyankee]

Eventhough he doesn't make the stat sheet often, I hope the Pats re-sign DL Jarvis Green. IMO he'll be a major sleeper in the upcoming FA market. He's an exceptional interior pass rusher who would be an ideal DT in a 4-3 defense for a team like the Falcons.

[NYPenn]

I thought you said the Pats LBs were older and slower, RIyankee?

Man, if Vrabel, Bruschi, McGinest and Co. are slow, that's truly frightening. I picture opposing QBs having very vivid nightmares about those guys.

[RIyankee]

Originally posted by NYPenn
I thought you said the Pats LBs were older and slower, RIyankee?

Man, if Vrabel, Bruschi, McGinest and Co. are slow, that's truly frightening. I picture opposing QBs having very vivid nightmares about those guys.

I didn't say they weren't quick, as opposed to being fast.

[reelbiggecko]

Originally posted by FreeYayo

Not if Rohan has anything to say about it

NFL Europe baby! The guy's a star!

[JeffWeaverFan]

Originally posted by RIyankee
That was a big "W" for the Pats. They could run the table now...

Dec 5 @Cleveland 1:00pm
Dec 12 Cincinnati 1:00pm
Dec 20 @Miami 9:00pm
Dec 26 @N.Y. Jets 4:05pm
Jan 2 San Francisco 1:00pm

The Dolphins/Jets back to back will be tough but if the Pats play well, they'll win both.

The Jets will beat them. Chad will have been back for a couple weeks by then and our offense should be clicking more.

[PlsDontTearDownY.S.]

There is nothing that could make me confident in the Jets scoring against the Pats. Chad is not the savior, he doesn't call the plays. In this league, what everybody thinks won't happen, does happen but I just can't see us taking chances against the Pats.

[RIyankee]

This week...

@Cleveland

Adding chaos (Davis firing) to an already bad team makes this match up too good to be true. Therefore, this will qualify as a "trap game".

As is the case every week with the Pats being the favorites, the same things apply for the Pats to win this game...

- stay away from the turnovers
- contain the run (Lee Suggs is a breakaway threat)
- pressure Holcolmb (he's a better QB than Boller)
- keep the penalties to a minimum

If the Pats do all these things, they will have this game won by the end of the 3rd quarter, if not sooner.

The intangiables of this game...

- the Browns have played the Pats tough in recent meetings
- the Browns scored 48 points in last week's loss to the Bengals
- Bill Bellichick has been terrific in preparing his team for "trap games" in the past

GO PATS!!!

[NYPenn]

"The Jets will beat them. Chad will have been back for a couple weeks by then and our offense should be clicking more."

Hmm, I don't know about that. By the time Dec. 26 rolls around, the Pats' patchwork secondary should be pretty much restored. Meanwhile, Colvin is getting better game by game - it's amazing to watch - and Wilfork is as well.

Funny how the Patriots can adjust to whatever's thrown at them. They'll match KC offensively, then come back and thump the physical Ravens. It's like "name the game, we'll play it. And beat you at it."

[reelbiggecko]

If the Pats don't run the table now I will be supremely disappointed. There is absolutely no reason why they should not.

[RIyankee]

Here are some things I'd like to see over the final 5 games...

- Put Troy Brown back at PR. All year my heart has been skipping a beat every time Kevin Faulk fields a punt. With Deion Branch back at WR we need Troy at PR again.

- I'd like to see FB Patrick Pass get more playing time. Based on my obsevations, he's become a better rusher than Faulk. Compared to Faulk, Pass is bigger, a better blocker, and better in the open field.

- I know I'm ranking on Faulk - I happen to like the guy - but I think Pass is the better player right now and Brown the better PR.

Here are some of my criticisms about Faulk...

- I saw him play in the 1999 Senior Bowl. He caught a screen pass and had empty space in front of him when a DB caught him from behind. I thought, a 5'9" 200lbs RB should have better open field speed than that. As a Patriot, Faulk has displayed some quickness but can't break away from defenders in the open field. I pegged him to be a 4th rounder, at best.

- GM Bobby Grier, who was a one-man wrecking crew for this franchise, expected to have a RB fall in his lap in the 2nd round of the 1999 NFL Draft. After a run on RBs early in the 2nd, Grier panicked and TRADED UP in the same round to nab Faulk. I'm glad those days are gone.

- Faulk goes down as soon as he's touched. He can't break tackles and can't make that first tackler miss.

- Faulk has small arms and looks like he's carrying a beach ball when running with the pigskin. Look at the last two Pats losses and a Faulk fumble is at the heart of them both. Last year, his fumble late in the game killed us in Washington. In 2004, I felt that Pats had a chance to get back into the Steelers game until Faulk put the ball on the ground on the first series of the 2nd half. That one nailed the coffin shut. The Colts had 1st and goal at the 1 in the final minutes of the 2003 regular season matchup, courtesy of a Faulk fumble when the Pats were trying to work on the clock. Fortunately the Pats "D" held.

- Faulk isn't getting any better. Patrick Pass is and deserves more PT.

[Buckeye Yank]

Originally posted by RIyankee
- pressure Holcolmb (he's a better QB than Boller)

You may not even see Holcomb. Supposedly he's hurting (ribs) and the Browns are contemplating starting McCown.

[RIyankee]

Originally posted by Buckeye Yank


You may not even see Holcomb. Supposedly he's hurting (ribs) and the Browns are contemplating starting McCown.

Not to be a wiseguy but...

Your Steelers have a tough game at Jacksonville Sunday night. If the Pats run the table and Pitt doesn't, the road to the SB will go through Foxboro.

[FreeYayo]

Originally posted by RIyankee
Here are some of my criticisms about Faulk...

Don't forget though
Without Faulk we might not win those 2 superbowls. He was a key guy in bailing antwaan out for a few years with his pass catching and route running out of the backfield.

But I do agree with what you said regarding Faulk. Atleast hes not dropping every punt to hiim like Bethel though

Also we need Brown on D until our Defensive backfield starts to get healed up.

Just think of how good this team is since we are missing Law and Poole and still stringing wins together. It's like last year when we were winning with a very banged up team and just got stronger as we started to heal.

A great thing about the team also is that we are not in any position where we have to draft to fill gaping holes on the team but rather draft best players available and improve depth. Do we have any extra picks in any rounds this year?

[RIyankee]

Originally posted by FreeYayo


Do we have any extra picks in any rounds this year?

Not yet. But I'm sure the Pats will get compensitory 2nd-day picks (anywhere from 4th-7th rounds) awarded by the NFL for the free agent losses of C Damien Woody and NT Ted Washington - both starters.