This game is fun
This game is fun
That was maddening. And IIRC, the game ended with Abreu striking out on a pitch that was like 6-inches off the plate.Originally Posted by Blazer
Can't forget this one:
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That was bizzare. Never seen that happen before or since.
I think people are actually being a bit harsh on the ump. First of all, that screen cap at the top is unfair. We all know it's about where the ball crosses the bag, not where it is after the bag. I still haven't seen anything terribly conclusive that the ball was indeed fair, other than circumstantial evidence.
this shouldn't come as a surprise to anybody... his eyes look closed all the time
I'm not sure what you're saying. The original call was incorrect, and then was overturned and made correct. Please don't cloud the issue with this stuff.
Regarding Ruth and Cobb, they played in a segregated game that was tainted by gambling. The further we get from that game, the better.
The ball was fair when it bounced before the bag, and then fair again when it bounced after the bag. Are you contending that the ball curved in the air to go around the outside of the bag? Are you Jim Garrison?
I am contending that that is a distinct possibility, yes. Balls do turn in weird ways after hitting the ground, believe it or not. And this is a closer call than everyone is making it out to be, too.
Because he's looking at where the ball crossed the bag...
How is it a physical impossibility?
ha. I was at that game.
oh my gods replays are the devil
oy vey
my point is when do you draw the line at going to replay for the answer? I mean why not use replay to call strikes? that completely removes the essence of baseball or having an ump call strikes.
I wont disagree that there have been terrible calls this year, but I dont think replay is the answer we should go for.
The real reason why the Yankees keep winning is cause the other team can't stop staring at the damn pinstripes
There's a difference between reviewing 300 pitches per game as opposed to 1 or 2 close plays.
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How much longer could those players have played if the DH was in their league? How many more hits? How many more RBIs? How many more years could pitchers have pitched if the mound wasn't lowered? How many more Ks and wins?
Baseball is not a static game. To suggest that we should keep it constant for the integrity of the game is myopic. You're ignoring 100 years of change.
Big Poopy agrees that the umpiring is turr-bel.
http://www.projo.com/redsox/content/...2.26ed7ca.html
Ortiz is never shy about letting umpires know when he doesn’t like a strike call.
After CC Sabathia struck him out three times on Saturday, Ortiz was ready to let everyone else know how unhappy he was, too.
“The fact is that on top of [Sabathia] being that good, he’s got [an ump] calling all kinds of [stuff] that made him better,” Ortiz said
"I'm sorry Smokey, you were over the line, that's a foul....mark it zero Dude, next frame"
Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/ba...#ixzz0w7VFYv85Thursday night in Miami, the Florida Marlins had a walk-off victory over the Phillies taken away from them when third-base umpire Bob Davidson egregiously blew the call on Gaby Sanchez's would-be tie-breaking base hit down the third-base line. Davidson called the ball foul despite all the replays showing it in fair territory before and after going over the bag. Despite that, Davidson, characteristically, refused to ask for help. But then, what else to expect from the worst umpire in baseball, an umpire who historically has been involved in terrible calls - and subsequent ugly confrontations with players and managers alike. This was an umpire who was fired by then-NL president Leonard Coleman years ago for general incompetence yet somehow allowed back into the fold by the MLB poobahs. It wasn't like he got any better in exile either. Last month, Bud Selig got rid of Jimmie Lee Solomon, the VP of administration in charge of the umpires, and replaced him with Frank Robinson. Selig did so because he is tired of being embarrassed by all the bad umpiring. To this, however, he needs to be asked two questions: How much more embarrassing do you need, and why is Bob Davidson still working in the majors?
Dumb & Dumber
The article is unfair in criticizing Davidson for not asking for help. Who was he supposed to ask for help? The HP umpire is the only one with a decent angle on the ball, but he's 90 feet away and might not have had time to set himself up on the line. And the 1B and 2B umps are nowhere near being in a position to make a call on a ball down the 3B line.
There's a reason that a play like that is the 3B ump's call, and that's because he's got by far the best look at it. He blew the call, but to criticize him for not asking people who had a worse angle on it for help isn't fair IMO.
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One of them probably noticed the ball landing inside the foul line, making it physically impossible for the ball to have crossed the base in foul territory.
The fair/foul thing is completely ridiculous, those should absolutely be subject to instant replay. I'm not sure how accurate MLB gameday is one balls/strikes, but I view a lot of games, and the homeplate umpiring has been consistently terrible.
Unless, of course, you believe this:
pspaint <3
Very unlikely, but definitely possible. If it had significant spin and was deflected by some ground matter like a pebble, sure it is possible.Unless, of course, you believe this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnus_effect
I take it you don't go bowling very often???(curves in bowling are not from the magnus effect, but that ruins the joke)
Oliver Stone can chronicle it with a film revolving around the "magic baseball".Very unlikely, but definitely possible. If it had significant spin and was deflected by some ground matter like a pebble, sure it is possible.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnus_effect
I take it you don't go bowling very often???
Joey Votto ejected for "not arguing" balls n strikes today in the 1st. Ball was about 6 inches above the zone, Votto said something and was tossed.
http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/news/...=.jsp&c_id=cin
That's absolutely ridiculous that Votto got ejected. It didn't look like he said anything to home plate umpire before he was ejected.
that's effing retarded... can't stand umps who think they're bigger than the game.
Did anyone see the piece on bad umpiring that ESPN ran on "Outside the Lines" today? Basically they studied 230 close calls (excluding balls/strikes) from 184 games over a random 2 week period and analyzed them on replay. 66% were deemed to be correct, 14% were too close to confirm or overturn, and 20% were cited as bad calls, i.e., if there was instant replay in baseball they would have been overturned.
Here is the link: http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/otl/n...ory?id=5464015
Never left the Betances bandwagon.
that was a good piece. thanks nel
The worst part was hearing the arguments for keeping instant replay out of baseball. Awful.
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Umpires are having a terrible year in general, but I think we're quick to jump at their throats these days. First off, that pitch was a strike. Votto mouthed off, walked away from the plate delaying the game and muttering something, stepped back in and clearly popped off again. I couldn't hear what Votto said, I'm pretty certain no one other than he and Reyburn know what he said. The article you link to says that Votto was popping off about a called strike to Bruce earlier. Even Baker's comments seemed to corroborate that and he didn't seem real surprised or upset that Votto got tossed.
I'm disappointed in the quality of calls this season and when umpires are in the spotlight it takes away from the game... but that doesn't mean players should be able to pop off about called strikes - particularly when they are accurate. It's getting to be like the NBA now, where every other foul is demonstrably argued by the unjustly whistled player. Seems like there's no such thing as a good strike three call for some players. Heck, this strike two call wasn't good enough for Votto.
I agree that the arguments in the ESPN piece were weak but there is a lot more to adding replay than just saying, "let's have replays." A lot of plays are asymmetrical in that if a ball that is actually foul is called fair, you can just send the players back to where they were and start over after the replay. However, if a ball that is actually fair is called foul, then what do you do? Call it a double and advance all runners two bases? It is one thing if that call happens on a screaming line drive down the left field line but something else if it happens on a bloop over the first baseman's head down the right field line. What if it occurs with two outs versus no outs and runners are running? I'm afraid that having expanded replays would not be satisfying to all concerned.
There seems to be a lot of speculation that a positive outcome from using instant replay in the LLWS will go a long way in forcing MLB to expand the current use of it. With the string of atrocious calls and lack of knowledge of the rulebook we've seen this year, it's a pretty sad commentary on the state of the game when the pros have to observe the way it's done with 12 year olds and guys who umpire the games for free.
September 28, 2008 - the day the HOF got a wake-up Moose call.
It's actually not that hard to do. The players should always run hard and finish the play. The ump could call a review of it. If it was fair, the play counted. If it was foul, the runners go back to where they started. But as long as the runners run and the fielders field and throw, the play would finish and you can make a ruling that everyone would be happy with.
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This is so wrong, in so many ways, I won't even begin to debate.
Larry King has spoken, thus ending all debate.....
http://www.esquire.com/features/what...#ixzz0wts37PJJ
"To not use technology to help officiate sporting events is insane. It's: Okay, we'll accept bad."
"I'm sorry Smokey, you were over the line, that's a foul....mark it zero Dude, next frame"
Might as well you already started it by posting anything at all.
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Yes, it would be hard to do.
Batter rips one a foot off the ground over the third base bag, the umpire immediately throws up his hands and signals foul. You think the runner on first is going to leg it all around to score, the left fielder is going to dig it out of the corner, fire it toward the plate where the first baseman cuts it off and throws the batter out at second just in case replay shows the ball was really fair?The players should always run hard and finish the play. The ump could call a review of it. If it was fair, the play counted. If it was foul, the runners go back to where they started. But as long as the runners run and the fielders field and throw, the play would finish and you can make a ruling that everyone would be happy with.
Everyone would have to become an umpire - the runners, fielders and batter - to make some determination if the ball was close enough to warrant a replay. That isn't even remotely realistic.
So, assuming everyone stops just like they do now as soon as the umpire emphatically signals foul, there would have to be some kind of rule such as the ground rule double to properly place the runners after replay shows the ball was really fair and that rule would have to be applied differently if there were two outs versus none or one out and if the runner in first was a fast or slow runner or else you'd have the blown call affecting the result of the play. Gee, just like now!
Well I was saying that with the assumption that if replay was something added, an ump would not immediately signal a foil, let the play resume and then review things that seem necessary to review. But I suppose that's unrealistic, so I surrender my argument.
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I'm actually in favor of expanding replay but the adjudication of any given play could certainly be problematic depending on just what plays are deemed to be reviewable. I'm just not sure the inch thick book of "adjudication rules" would leave players, managers and fans any more satisfied than they are now.
Looks like someone beat me to it. That's only one of hundreds of instances that could occur.
As each year passes I am starting to be more in favor of replays as well. It's really hard to say what is worthy and what isn't and to what extent and what effect it will have on game length.
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This is why Umpires are trained to call fair if it is too close to tell, or if they missed it. It is much easier to ask the home plate umpire for assistance after the play and say it was foul, then it is to talk to the home plate umpire and rule it fair then decide where each runner would end up.
the easiest solution is just to get rid of everyone right now and hire new umpires under 40.. a lot of these problems seems to occur because they're old, senile, privileged f**** who don't give a crap about the game anymore and see themselves as bigger than what's going on on the field
See: Joe West.
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i see joe west alright:
Not a "blown call", but another example of umpire stupidity
Per ESPN...
News: Zimmerman was ejected from Wednesday's game in the eighth inning.
Spin: If you saw that he left the game early in the box score, there's nothing to worry about. Zimmerman got the heave from home plate ump Scott Barry after tossing his helmet and bat in disgust following a strikeout, which wouldn't be that noteworthy except that he struck out swinging and didn't say a word to Barry
I was watching that game and couldn't believe he gave Zimmermann the hook. If you can't tell the difference between a player being digusted with himself and digusted with you, you probably can't tell the difference between a ball and strike either. However, Zimmerman struck out swinging.
September 28, 2008 - the day the HOF got a wake-up Moose call.
Nik Markakis last night was ejected after he "questioned" 4 pitches, 3 were called strikes. Brutal. Buck went nuts
Exactly, it used be your goal as an Umpire to sit in the corner and hope no one notices you. Now it's their goal to get every call right and make sure everyone agrees with you and doesn't disrespect you. If they do, then throw them out. That's the problem with umpires these days, they don't try to go unnoticed, they try to make sure everything goes exactly how they feel it should, even if its not the right way.
And to anyone who says yes to replay needs to check out college football. It is the most exciting game play of all sports in my opinion, only problem is after every play, there is a review. Nothing worse then watching your team score a touchdown with 20 seconds left to take the lead, then having to sit for 5 minutes to see if he really scored, or if he stepped out at the 3 yard line. That's what will happen in baseball. Even if you can easily see in a second that the runner beat the throw to first, you still have to deal with the time it takes a coach to run out, challenge a play, and then umpires see the play and overturn it. And that will happen more often then coaches coming out to argue. Because right now if it's a bang bang play, the manager will give the umpire the benefit of the doubt. But if he can challenge the play, then he will challenge any play that is close.
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