Lets Go Rangers! 2010-2011 season thread

[dabomb2045]

Larry Brooks thinks we should make a run at Kovalchuk

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/range...DPV738R5bJ1RvK

[B]Impeccable sources have told The Post that the Devils have a contract offer on the table to Kovalchuk for 17 years at more than $100 million, and front-loaded so that Kovalchuk would collect $100 million over the first 10 years of the deal. Yet the winger, who recorded 27 points (10-27) as a Devils' rental while enjoying his experience in New Jersey, hasn't accepted it.

Nevertheless, the Rangers as currently constructed do not have nearly enough top-end talent to contend for anything meaningful in a league that increasingly is dominated by its elite players.

Plus, they are not going to bottom out for years the way the reigning Cup champion Blackhawks and the 2009 champion Penguins did in order to add people like Jonathan Toews, Patrick Kane, Sidney Crosby, Evgeni Malkin and Marc-Andre Fleury.

Plus, elite players don't get to unrestricted free agency in hockey -- they get "lifetime" deals coming out of their Entry Level contracts so that they never reach the market.

Except there's Kovalchuk on the market, a singular threat every time he's on the ice. Except there's this marquee goal-scoring machine-41 last year, 230 over the last six years including two seasons of 52-longing for the bright lights who's there for the taking.

The big-market, big-revenue teams that drive the NHL have two advantages in the hard-cap CBA that has two years to run. They can afford to erase mistakes by sending big-money contracts to the minors and they can afford heavily front-loaded "lifetime" deals that guarantee huge cash to the athlete yet keeps the cap hit manageable.

These teams have two summers in which to flaunt their economic power. The Rangers have this September to demote Wade Redden and they have this summer to get Kovalchuk. No one of similar value will be on the market next year.

Sather has serious issues with the summer cap that will demand creativity in order to solve. The general manager might have to surrender a No. 3 in order to get Donald Brashear's over-35 charge of $1.4 million off the cap, but if that's what it takes to clear the space to land Kovalchuk, so be it.

Kovalchuk is likely to make his decision within the next 48-to-72 hours. The window is open for the Rangers to sign a talent the likes of which they won't otherwise have the opportunity to add for years.

[CanoForPresident]

Two Words...

Cap Space.

We don't have it. The magnitude of the moves that would need to happen to open up the space needed aren't worth it (more than just waiving Redden.)

Talent is great, we need it and if we didn't have Gaborik under contract then Kovalchuk would make a ton of sense, but there is no point in signing another guy long term for more than 7 mill per year just to become marginally better.

That is, if we intend to hold onto all of our young talent that we have on the team now and will have on the team over the next few years. Kovalchuk will do nothing but guarantee a few playoff round wins and continued mediocrity.

[bluecountry]

When is Don Legreca going to stop being a phony?
Can't stand how on NHL Network he acts like Mr. Hockey then goes on the Michael Kay and wants nothing to do with the sport.
Have some balls big guy.

[RhodyYanksFan]

When is Don Legreca going to stop being a phony?
Can't stand how on NHL Network he acts like Mr. Hockey then goes on the Michael Kay and wants nothing to do with the sport.
Have some balls big guy.

What did he say on the MK Show? I like him on that show because he's usually more grounded and rational than most other sports radio hosts.

[CanoForPresident]

So guys, what would you be willing to give up to get Bobby Ryan to NY?

I know their GM has said that they aren't trading him and while that may end up being the case, I don't believe him.

Also, props to Slats for staying out of the Kovalchuk madness.

[b_joseph]

Potential 40 goal scorer at any given time + 23 years old = Bend over and hope it doesnt hurt too much.

Put it this way, if we had him...what would you want for him? You'd be looking for a teams best couple of prospects..their #1 draft selections..and more.

[CanoForPresident]

Potential 40 goal scorer at any given time + 23 years old = Bend over and hope it doesnt hurt too much.

Put it this way, if we had him...what would you want for him? You'd be looking for a teams best couple of prospects..their #1 draft selections..and more.

I don't know how much prospects would help them since they'd need a body to make up for some of what Ryan produced so Dubinsky is the logical roster player that would be going the other way.

On top of that, a load of picks. Honestly, If we're going to overpay out the ass for some one, It better be for someone of Ryan's ilk. Hes got size and skill, and with a little bit of time, may develop into one of the 10 best forwards in the league. Hes Mario Lemieux-lite in my eyes.

[b_joseph]

I'm with you...Its just that it would be one of those moves where the team would have to become instant contenders because of just what you'd have to give up in relation to your future.

I dont think that describes us, so I'd be skeptical.

Lets think about it. Dubi, Staal, Kreider and an assortment of high draft picks for a few years...that would hurt me.

[CanoForPresident]

I'm with you...Its just that it would be one of those moves where the team would have to become instant contenders because of just what you'd have to give up in relation to your future.

I dont think that describes us, so I'd be skeptical.

Lets think about it. Dubi, Staal, Kreider and an assortment of high draft picks for a few years...that would hurt me.

lmfao I'd tell them to ................ off hard if they asked for that.

Honestly, you could probably get him for Staal straight up and I'd have a problem doing that only cuz that would be plugging up one hole while opening up another.

A Staal less package could probably get it done but you're talking about dubi, a prospect, and multiple picks.

[b_joseph]

Staal straight up? Thats bold...you yourself called him Mario-lite and Mario-lite is worth much more than Staal. Especially a Staal that hasnt fully shown his offensive side of the game.

[CanoForPresident]

Staal straight up? Thats bold...you yourself called him Mario-lite and Mario-lite is worth much more than Staal. Especially a Staal that hasnt fully shown his offensive side of the game.

Staal is already one of the top 10 defensive defensemen in the game. He'll only get better and was an absolute rock last year. He was eating something like 27 minutes of ice down the stretch.

LOL at NJD!

[b_joseph]

Yeah, I gues but Bobby Ryan is on the verge of being really special. Not to say that Staal isnt because IMO and lots of our opinions, he is.

Is it easier to find a Staal type or a Bobby Ryan type?

[RhodyYanksFan]

We have a few nice young defensemen, but Staal is the best by far. If they could do a deal for Dubi, any non-Staal d-man, one of Krieder/Bourque and some picks, they should do it.

[CanoForPresident]

Yeah, I gues but Bobby Ryan is on the verge of being really special. Not to say that Staal isnt because IMO and lots of our opinions, he is.

Is it easier to find a Staal type or a Bobby Ryan type?

Neither

Defensemen are more valued in this league than Forwards are, especially ones who are under 27 and already as good as Staal.

I think Ryan can be had with out giving up Staal or any prospects, but it really comes down to if you believe that giving up 3-4 1st and 2nd round draft picks (Combined, not 3-4 each) is worth it. I think it is, but I can understand if people don't believe that this is the time to make such a move.

[RhodyYanksFan]

Neither

Defensemen are more valued in this league than Forwards are, especially ones who are under 27 and already as good as Staal.

I think Ryan can be had with out giving up Staal or any prospects, but it really comes down to if you believe that giving up 3-4 1st and 2nd round draft picks (Combined, not 3-4 each) is worth it. I think it is, but I can understand if people don't believe that this is the time to make such a move.

If they can get Ryan, and have Gaborik, hopefully Mike Richards next year, Kreider, Stepan, Grachev, Callahan, Staal, MDZ and Henrik still in his prime - you have to try to do it.

[CanoForPresident]

If they can get Ryan, and have Gaborik, hopefully Mike Richards next year, Kreider, Stepan, Grachev, Callahan, Staal, MDZ and Henrik still in his prime - you have to try to do it.

Brad Richards, but I agree 100%.

[RhodyYanksFan]

Brad Richards, but I agree 100%.

Get them both? lol.

[CanoForPresident]

I HATE Mike Richards...

[RhodyYanksFan]

I HATE Mike Richards...

He probably hates you too.

[MTYankee23]

Neither

Defensemen are more valued in this league than Forwards are, especially ones who are under 27 and already as good as Staal.

I think Ryan can be had with out giving up Staal or any prospects, but it really comes down to if you believe that giving up 3-4 1st and 2nd round draft picks (Combined, not 3-4 each) is worth it. I think it is, but I can understand if people don't believe that this is the time to make such a move.

If I were a team that was planning on being a SC contender the next 3-5 years, I'd trade my next 3 1's for him. Not that the Bruins have the space to pull this off like the Rangers do (without giving Michael Ryder a Garmin that only points to the Dunkin' Donuts Center in Providence), but Blake Wheeler, Matt Hunwick, and 3 1sts to Anaheim. . . That would be my next move as Boston's GM, I'd even justify it with our miserly owner by saying that we'll make up for Ryder's salary with Bobby Ryan jersey sales and playoff tickets.

So to get back to your Rangers, everything you're saying here is absolutely right. Especially considering the Rangers, in my mind, have the prospect base to make up for the lost picks (which would instantly become much, much lower anyway).

[RhodyYanksFan]

So to get back to your Rangers, everything you're saying here is absolutely right. Especially considering the Rangers, in my mind, have the prospect base to make up for the lost picks (which would instantly become much, much lower anyway).

Didn't even think about that. You have to believe that what happened this year with Boston and Toronto wouldn't occur again and the picks the Rangers would trade would ideally end up in the 20's and not in the top 5.

[CanoForPresident]

If I were a team that was planning on being a SC contender the next 3-5 years, I'd trade my next 3 1's for him. Not that the Bruins have the space to pull this off like the Rangers do (without giving Michael Ryder a Garmin that only points to the Dunkin' Donuts Center in Providence), but Blake Wheeler, Matt Hunwick, and 3 1sts to Anaheim. . . That would be my next move as Boston's GM, I'd even justify it with our miserly owner by saying that we'll make up for Ryder's salary with Bobby Ryan jersey sales and playoff tickets.

So to get back to your Rangers, everything you're saying here is absolutely right. Especially considering the Rangers, in my mind, have the prospect base to make up for the lost picks (which would instantly become much, much lower anyway).

Wait, we have space?

We'd have enough to get a deal done, but we'd be right up against it.

That said, If you can get Ryan with out giving up Staal then you do it.

Like Rhody said, if you add Ryan and Richards next year to a group that already has Gaborik, Anisimov, Lundqvist, Staal, Girardi, Del Zotto and Callahan with Kreider, Stepan, Grachev, McDonagh, McIlrath and Werek on the way, That team is contending in 2 years and beyond.

[MTYankee23]

Didn't even think about that. You have to believe that what happened this year with Boston and Toronto wouldn't occur again and the picks the Rangers would trade would ideally end up in the 20's and not in the top 5.

Yeah, those are totally different situations. The Leafs were a bottom 5 team in terms of goal differential the year prior to the Kessel trade, and it arguably didn't fill their biggest weakness. Bobby Ryan is just what the doctor ordered for the Rangers, and they were middle of the pack goal differential wise. If they gave up their next 3 1sts, or 2 1sts and a 2nd like Toronto did, none of those picks would be top 20.

[CanoForPresident]

Yeah, those are totally different situations. The Leafs were a bottom 5 team in terms of goal differential the year prior to the Kessel trade, and it arguably didn't fill their biggest weakness. Bobby Ryan is just what the doctor ordered for the Rangers, and they were middle of the pack goal differential wise. If they gave up their next 3 1sts, or 2 1sts and a 2nd like Toronto did, none of those picks would be top 20.

I disagree.

Even with Ryan, we'd still pick in the top 20 next year but thats fine, as long as it isn't a top 2 pick like Toronto's turned out to be, you live with it and move on.

If you've got a pretty full farm and a chance to get a great player who can potentially be an "elite' player that isn't in the farm, then it makes sense to move a few of those draft choices to get that guy. I don't know about giving up 3 1sts, but 2 1sts and a second in addition to a roster player seems to be fine value. Hell, Id give them all of our selections in the first 2 rounds (we've got 2 in the second next year) for the next 2 years in addition to Dubinsky to get it done.

Some of those picks may turn out to be great players in a few years, but that'll sting a lot less when you get to ice a great team much sooner.

[MTYankee23]

Wait, we have space?

We'd have enough to get a deal done, but we'd be right up against it.

That said, If you can get Ryan with out giving up Staal then you do it.

Like Rhody said, if you add Ryan and Richards next year to a group that already has Gaborik, Anisimov, Lundqvist, Staal, Girardi, Del Zotto and Callahan with Kreider, Stepan, Grachev, McDonagh, McIlrath and Werek on the way, That team is contending in 2 years and beyond.

Haha, I was under the impression that you did, relative to us at least.

[RhodyYanksFan]

I disagree.

Even with Ryan, we'd still pick in the top 20 next year but thats fine, as long as it isn't a top 2 pick like Toronto's turned out to be, you live with it and move on.

If you've got a pretty full farm and a chance to get a great player who can potentially be an "elite' player that isn't in the farm, then it makes sense to move a few of those draft choices to get that guy. I don't know about giving up 3 1sts, but 2 1sts and a second in addition to a roster player seems to be fine value. Hell, Id give them all of our selections in the first 2 rounds (we've got 2 in the second next year) for the next 2 years in addition to Dubinsky to get it done.

Some of those picks may turn out to be great players in a few years, but that'll sting a lot less when you get to ice a great team much sooner.

So is it safe to say Dubinsky has reached his potential as a player - or would it be a move that would benefit both the team and him if they dealt him elsewhere? I hate when guys leave then get amazing, but if this is the most we're gonna get out of Dubi, then he's more valuable as a trading chip IMO.

[CanoForPresident]

So is it safe to say Dubinsky has reached his potential as a player - or would it be a move that would benefit both the team and him if they dealt him elsewhere? I hate when guys leave then get amazing, but if this is the most we're gonna get out of Dubi, then he's more valuable as a trading chip IMO.

I don't think hes reached his potential. Hes shown at times that he can be a very good 2nd line player but he doesn't play with much consistency.

Dubi at his best probably puts up the same amount of points that Ryan does now. He makes sense in a trade since hes similar in age and fits the playing style of what the Ducks look for (hes the only semi passable top six forward we have who isn't Gaborik), and he isn't a bad player at all. In a way, hes sort of the one expendable chip that we have who is attractive to other teams.

I'm all for moving Dubinsky in a deal for the right player. I was hoping that Slats dangled him in a package for Suter or Weber a few years ago when Nashville wasn't sure if they could sign them both and I'm fine with moving him for Ryan now since you'd be upgrading that position.

What I wouldn't be happy with is moving him for an older player (Savard for instance) or for in a package for a semi young player with a big contract (Spezza.)

[CanoForPresident]

Haha, I was under the impression that you did, relative to us at least.

We've got about 5 mill in space right now and close to 11 with the extra space allowed during the summer. More than enough space to get both Ryan and Staal signed and then some if Dubinsky goes the other way (and then Redden gets waived at the start of the season.)

Next year would be a little more interesting, but we've got 10+ mill coming off the books but we'd need to get Anisimov and Callahan re upped (they'll probably get 5 mill between them.) Unless Richards is willing to take one of those cap dancing deals, we'd have to move another body to make room for him. It'd be tight, but we should be able to get it done.

We'd have nothing to worry about 2 off seasons from now since close to 20 mill will come off the books (15 if Rozsival gets dealt before hand), and a bunch of young talent ready to step in.

[SLURPEE]

I would love B.Ryan but what could they trade for him? Picks and Dubinsky? Is that enough to get it done without giving up major prospects?

[CanoForPresident]

I would love B.Ryan but what could they trade for him? Picks and Dubinsky? Is that enough to get it done without giving up major prospects?

I just threw that out there as an example of what I'd give up.

For all I know, the asking price may actually be a prospect or two on top of that, which is pretty much a memo to all other GM's stating that "Ryan is unavailable unless you're stupid."

I'm not advocating getting Ryan at all costs. I say go get him if you can get him with out losing Staal or top prospects (or one at most.)

[SLURPEE]

This line would be sick:

Kreider--Stepan--Ryan

[CanoForPresident]

This line would be sick:

Kreider--Stepan--Ryan

Both on the Rangers and in Sochi in 2014!

Imagine backing up that line with Grachev-Richards-Gaborik

We'd be peeing on the Devils, their fans and the rest of the EC.

[CanoForPresident]

Apparently we're interested in Frolov and Ponikorovsky....

I guess Slats waited a little longer to take his stupid pills this offseason (Frolov isn't awful, but he doesn't fit this team.)

Frolov on a one year deal honestly wouldn't be the worst thing in the world (30 goal 60 point upside and at the worst, a nice chip to move in March) but Ponikorovsky would be a Kotalik like disaster.

[RhodyYanksFan]

He must sit with a big white board of lines and wherever there's a blank spot he just picks a name out of a hat to fill the hole.

[CanoForPresident]

I wish he'd pick out a good name more often.

Rangers released their Roster for the Traverse City tournament -

2010 NY RANGERS TRAVERSE CITY PROSPECTS TOURNAMENT ROSTER

Forwards

Player POS. HT WT Age 2008-09 Team (League)
Ryan Bourque LW 5-9 171 19 Quebec (QMJHL)
Evgeny Grachev RW 6-4 222 20 Hartford (AHL)
Roman Horak C 6-0 175 19 Chilliwack (WHL)
Colin Martin LW 6-2 206 19 London (OHL)
Chris McKelvie RW 6-1 195 25 Bemidji State (CHA); Hartford (AHL)
Randy McNaught RW 6-4 220 19 Saskatoon (WHL)
Brendan Shinnimin C 5-10 176 19 Tri-City (WHL)
Derek Stepan C 6-0 187 20 Wisconsin (WCHA)
Christian Thomas RW 5-9 164 18 Oshawa (OHL)
Ethan Werek C 6-1 195 19 Kingston (OHL)
Jason Wilson LW 6-2 206 20 Owen Sound (OHL)
Andrew Yogan LW 6-3 203 18 Erie (OHL)

Defensemen
Lee Baldwin D 6-3 200 22 Alaska-Anchorage (WCHA); Hartford (AHL)
Sam Klassen D 6-2 199 21 Saskatoon (WHL)
Tomas Kundratek D 6-2 200 20 Medicine Hat (WHL)
Dan Maggio D 6-3 202 19 Sudbury (OHL)
Brandon Manning D 6-1 195 20 Chilliwack (WHL)
Dylan McIlrath D 6-4 218 18 Moose Jaw (WHL)
Ryan McDonagh D 6-1 222 21 Wisconsin (WCHA)
Jyri Niemi D 6-2 208 20 Saskatoon (WHL)

Goaltenders

Scott Stajcer G 6-3 200 19 Owen Sound (OHL)
Cam Talbot G 6-3 205 23 Alabama-Huntsville (CHA); Hartford (AHL)

http://rangers.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=534922&navid=DL|NYR|home

Pretty stacked roster for this tournament.

[RhodyYanksFan]

Apparently we're interested in Frolov and Ponikorovsky....

I guess Slats waited a little longer to take his stupid pills this offseason (Frolov isn't awful, but he doesn't fit this team.)

Frolov on a one year deal honestly wouldn't be the worst thing in the world (30 goal 60 point upside and at the worst, a nice chip to move in March) but Ponikorovsky would be a Kotalik like disaster.

Frolov sounds like he'd be 2010's Zherdev. Hopefully Glen doesn't pay him 4.5 million too.

[CanoForPresident]

Frolov sounds like he'd be 2010's Zherdev. Hopefully Glen doesn't pay him 4.5 million too.

I don't think thats a fair comparison. Frolov is actually a team player.

He was mis casted last year with the Kings on the third line (along with Dustin Brown, wtf?) so his numbers suffered a bit. Frolov doesn't have Zherdev's mits but he has pretty good size and uses it well. He scores a bunch of his goals from the circles in. Hes 2 seasons removed from a 30 goal season and has broken the 70 point plateau, two things that Zherdev has never done.

Frolov isn't a bad player and if we had a better roster he may be a guy I'd be willing to take on but all he does at this point is weaken our draft position and put us pretty much where we were last year, right on the bubble of an 8th seed or barely missing out.

The Frolov's and Ponikarovsky's are guys we should stay clear of. Trying to swing a trade for someone like Bobby Ryan or James Neal, if they're available, is what Slats should be looking at if hes going to do anything at all. Those are guys who will improve the team, sure, but they're also young enough to be a part of the core in future years.

[CanoForPresident]

Annnd apparently we're on the cusp of signing Frolov for 1-2 years between 2-3 mill per.

I hate Sather.

[RhodyYanksFan]

An article I read makes it sound like it's only for one year at $2.9 million. However right now we're only 2.2 million under the cap and they still have to sign Staal so I have no idea why they're rushing in to this Frolov deal. Its not like other teams were knocking down his door.

One good thing is if this happens it probably means the end of Redden.

[Kluivert4Ever]

Annnd apparently we're on the cusp of signing Frolov for 1-2 years between 2-3 mill per.

I hate Sather.

Swedish newspapers are reporting that its a 1 year deal and its all but done.

[dabomb2045]

I talked about this move w/CFP last night....Frolov's a solid player but its not someone we need. If we were a contending team, looking for a final piece or two....he'd be the perfect guy. Of course we are far away from that so this move makes little sense.

Sather has NO plan. NONE. Its pathetic.

[Kluivert4Ever]

I talked about this move w/CFP last night....Frolov's a solid player but its not someone we need. If we were a contending team, looking for a final piece or two....he'd be the perfect guy. Of course we are far away from that so this move makes little sense.

Sather has NO plan. NONE. Its pathetic.

I agree that Sather has no plan, but if its indeed a 1 year deal its not a big deal IMO.

[CanoForPresident]

An article I read makes it sound like it's only for one year at $2.9 million. However right now we're only 2.2 million under the cap and they still have to sign Staal so I have no idea why they're rushing in to this Frolov deal. Its not like other teams were knocking down his door.

One good thing is if this happens it probably means the end of Redden.

Actually we're closer to 4 mill under the cap. I don't know why NHLscap and all those other cap relates sites keep on counting MZA's contract under the current cap, but his contract doesn't count until the season starts (as is the case with all two way contracts where the player didn't play a single NHL game the previous season.) Thats an extra 1.75 mill of space.

We'll have 6+ mill to get Staal re-signed, which is more than he'll end up getting sans an offer sheet. But you're right, this move would really signal the end of Redden, unless they move both Rozsival and Dubinsky (the latter have, I'm actually in favor of doing if Frolov is signed)

[CanoForPresident]

1 year 3 mill for Frolov, its official. Not the way I wanted to go but its certainly not a disaster move.

That gives us uh, about 7 mill with the summer cap for Staal.

We've got an abundance of wingers right now. Slats has to have something else up his sleeve.

[b_joseph]

6 of one and half a dozen of the other.

Nothing move..nothing good and nothing bad.

It is what it is.

Cant think of anymore sayings

[CanoForPresident]

6 of one and half a dozen of the other.

Nothing move..nothing good and nothing bad.

It is what it is.

Cant think of anymore sayings

We're still in it?

[b_joseph]

Hey, that goes without saying!

Frolov never struck me as a Torts type but what the hey!!!

[CanoForPresident]

That hes not. I do think that Frolov and Gaborik would compliment each other really well though.

I don't see Torts sticking around much longer. Not to say that its fault (almost all of it lies with the guy who has somehow kept his job for 10 years) but another sub par season and the dude is out, that is if he doesn't KO Brooksie first

[b_joseph]

On the ice @ MSG. Brooks vs Torts on skates...first blood wins.

Problem is CFP..What constitutes as a sub par season with this roster? I cant really get on him at all this year because nobody thinks this team can contend for the playoff spot.

[CanoForPresident]

On the ice @ MSG. Brooks vs Torts on skates...first blood wins.

Problem is CFP..What constitutes as a sub par season with this roster? I cant really get on him at all this year because nobody thinks this team can contend for the playoff spot.

Say what you want about Torts, but he would beat the living ................ out of Brooksie with out breaking a sweat. I'd pay to see that though.

I think missing the playoffs is still a sub par season. Frolov wouldn't have been signed if this team didn't think that they had a chance at playing hockey past game 82. If they miss out again, I'd bet that Torts is out and that Slats goes with him (on his own accord, handing over the GM duties to Messier )


The only thing to look forward to with this team (if the roster stands as it is) has been the same thing it was last year, the development of the young players.

Being a fan of this team has gone from being exciting (the 05-06 season was a lot of fun, even if that team sans Jagr wasn't very good because the players actually cared) to staying in a bad marriage for the sake of the kids.