Red Sox Thread Version 5.0

[Yankeeah]

I'm surprised the Red Sox fans haven't petitioned for the GRIT statistic to count in the standings.

[blumj]

Victor Martinez is being activated off the DL and starting tonight, Dusty Brown sent back to AAA.

[Rice14]

Victor Martinez is being activated off the DL and starting tonight, Dusty Brown sent back to AAA.

Hallelujah.

[THEBOSS84]

Just in time to face Haren.

[False1]

He may not be an ace, but I'd take 2008 or 2009 Josh Beckett as my #2 any day. Hell, with the way Buchholz is pitching, Beckett is a 3 right now.

What about 2010 or 2006 Beckett? You ok with paying him AAV $17MM for the next four years?

[hardrain]

WEEI mentioned today that NESN's ratings are way down this year (like 36%)... radio ratings are also down by quite a bit.

This is all a result of Peter Abraham now covering the team.

[Rice14]

What about 2010 or 2006 Beckett? You ok with paying him AAV $17MM for the next four years?

I have to believe that 2010 Beckett was not really Beckett due to injury.

If he pitches to about a 120 ERA plus, which is what his first four years in Boston averaged out to, then I can live with the contract. He may be a little overpaid, but that's how the pitching market has gone.

[blumj]

Just in time to face Haren.

They got him in interleague already, too.

[teknetic]

I have a hard time believing Beckett was pitching with an injured back all season.

[THEBOSS84]

They got him in interleague already, too.

How'd he do vs them?

[Yankeeah]

How'd he do vs them?

Without looking it up, I believe they crushed him

[blumj]

Without looking it up, I believe they crushed him

If I remember right, much of it was more the D-Backs fielding than Haren's pitching.

[THEBOSS84]

I just checked. He gave up 4 ER in 5.2 IP with 10 base-runners (3 BBs) and 4 K's.

[Rice14]

I have a hard time believing Beckett was pitching with an injured back all season.

Scenario 1: A pretty good pitcher pitched the worst baseball of his career due to an injury that caused him to eventually miss two months.

Scenario 2: A pretty good pitcher pitched the worst baseball of his career and in a complete coincidence that had nothing to do with the rest of his season got hurt and missed two months.

You can choose to believe whichever one you want.

[S2]

What about 2010 or 2006 Beckett? You ok with paying him AAV $17MM for the next four years?

Yeah. Rarely are long-term contracts completed with the player not having some sort of dropoff. It's expected.

As for 2006 Beckett, that was a long time ago. I wouldn't want 2006 Pedroia or 2006 Youkilis on my team either. And much like Beckett, I don't see those guys reverting to their 2006 numbers either. I would like 2006 Jonathan Papelbon back, please.

[THEBOSS84]

Yeah. Rarely are long-term contracts completed with the player not having some sort of dropoff. It's expected.

As for 2006 Beckett, that was a long time ago. I wouldn't want 2006 Pedroia or 2006 Youkilis on my team either. And much like Beckett, I don't see those guys reverting to their 2006 numbers either. I would like 2006 Jonathan Papelbon back, please.

How rare is it for a long-term contract to begin with a large drop-off?

[Rice14]

How rare is it for a long-term contract to begin with a large drop-off?

I guess you missed the Julio Lugo era.

[S2]

How rare is it for a long-term contract to begin with a large drop-off?

Actually, smartypants, it hasn't even begun yet.

[THEBOSS84]

Actually, smartypants, it hasn't even begun yet.

Haha, wow you're right.

• 4 years/$68M (2011-14)
  • signed extension with Boston 4/5/10
  • $5M signing bonus
  • 11:$15.75M, 12:$15.75M, 13:$15.75M, 14:$15.75M

I can't tell if you've won or lost the argument now...

[S2]

Haha, wow you're right.

• 4 years/$68M (2011-14)
  • signed extension with Boston 4/5/10
  • $5M signing bonus
  • 11:$15.75M, 12:$15.75M, 13:$15.75M, 14:$15.75M

I can't tell if you've won or lost the argument now...

Let's say I won and never speak of this again.

[teknetic]

Scenario 1: A pretty good pitcher pitched the worst baseball of his career due to an injury that caused him to eventually miss two months.

Scenario 2: A pretty good pitcher pitched the worst baseball of his career and in a complete coincidence that had nothing to do with the rest of his season got hurt and missed two months.

You can choose to believe whichever one you want.

He pitched to a 5.50 ERA over a three month period in 2006. Lets chalk that one up to a readjustment phase because it's not possible for an aceof his caliber to pitch like turd for any extended amount of time.

[False1]

Yeah. Rarely are long-term contracts completed with the player not having some sort of dropoff. It's expected.

As for 2006 Beckett, that was a long time ago. I wouldn't want 2006 Pedroia or 2006 Youkilis on my team either. And much like Beckett, I don't see those guys reverting to their 2006 numbers either. I would like 2006 Jonathan Papelbon back, please.

Sure, if you're throwing a big contract at a guy to get him to change laundry. But the Sox extended Beckett while he still had a year on his existing deal. I'm pretty confident Theo didn't expect this, and would not have given Beckett a four year this offseason after seeing how '10 has played out.

[Yankee Fan in Boston]

Actually, smartypants, it hasn't even begun yet.

Damn, I was just reading the thread and wanted to correct Seymour. He used to be up on stuff like this

[Rice14]

He pitched to a 5.50 ERA over a three month period in 2006. Lets chalk that one up to a readjustment phase because it's not possible for an aceof his caliber to pitch like turd for any extended amount of time.

That's still nearly two runs better than what he started this season at.

I love how you resorted to putting words in my mouth though, that's always the hallmark of a guy who can't make any other argument. Where did I call him an ace? He's a guy who came into the season with a career ERA above 115, never had a season lower than 95, yet started this year in the 60's before going on the DL for two months. Why is it such a stretch to imagine that his back may have been bothering him for some time before going on the DL?

[THEBOSS84]

Damn, I was just reading the thread and wanted to correct Seymour. He used to be up on stuff like this

I'm disappointed in myself. I used to be able to rattle off contracts like it was my own salary.

[THEBOSS84]

I guess you missed the Julio Lugo era.

Haha, well played.

[Rice14]

Sure, if you're throwing a big contract at a guy to get him to change laundry. But the Sox extended Beckett while he still had a year on his existing deal. I'm pretty confident Theo didn't expect this, and would not have given Beckett a four year this offseason after seeing how '10 has played out.

Maybe, this is the second back injury Beckett has had in three years. Factor in the concerns the Sox have about his shoulder and Theo may definitely be crossing his fingers right about now.

[S2]

Sure, if you're throwing a big contract at a guy to get him to change laundry. But the Sox extended Beckett while he still had a year on his existing deal. I'm pretty confident Theo didn't expect this, and would not have given Beckett a four year this offseason after seeing how '10 has played out.

These are the risks involved with free agents and near free agents.

[S2]

That's still nearly two runs better than what he started this season at.

I love how you resorted to putting words in my mouth though, that's always the hallmark of a guy who can't make any other argument. Where did I call him an ace? He's a guy who came into the season with a career ERA above 115, never had a season lower than 95, yet started this year in the 60's before going on the DL for two months. Why is it such a stretch to imagine that his back may have been bothering him for some time before going on the DL?

Joe Girardi probably still doesn't think he was hurt.

[False1]

These are the risks involved with free agents and near free agents.

Of course. But I think you're not being objective if you say that you're pleased with the extension he signed ealier this year in light of what has taken place this season.

[MassNYYfan]

I think some people have just gotten off the bandwagon.

Grit's too expensive in this recession.

[S2]

Of course. But I think you're not being objective if you say that you're pleased with the extension he signed ealier this year in light of what has taken place this season.

I'm ok with it, that's about as far as I'll go. I also think his start to this season is a terrible combination of injury and SSS. I'm confident he can turn it around.

[awy]

harennnnnnnnn! still slightly mad.

[teknetic]

That's still nearly two runs better than what he started this season at.

I'm just showing that he's capable of having long periods of suck.

I love how you resorted to putting words in my mouth though, that's always the hallmark of a guy who can't make any other argument. Where did I call him an ace?

I didn't put words in your mouth, I was poking fun at the douchey writers who keep pegging him as some sort "ace."

He's a guy who came into the season with a career ERA above 115, never had a season lower than 95, yet started this year in the 60's before going on the DL for two months. Why is it such a stretch to imagine that his back may have been bothering him for some time before going on the DL?

Vasquez was nearly as awful for the first month and a half. Did anyone peg that as an injury? no, he just sucked. If he was pitching with a bad back for that long, your medical crew sucks at their jobs.

[Rice14]

Vasquez was nearly as awful for the first month and a half. Did anyone peg that as an injury? no, he just sucked. If he was pitching with a bad back for that long, your medical crew sucks at their jobs.

Pitchers try to pitch through injuries all the time. Even after going on the DL Beckett said he didn't think it was a big deal and would be back by June 3rd. This isn't the first time Beckett has had back touble and probably won't be the last. As stubborn as he is, I could see him trying to pitch through it.

As for Vasquez, I seem to remember some speculation that he may have a physical problem when he was struggling. It certainly would have been a plausible explanation for why he was pitching so badly and had he revealed an injury and gone on the DL for two months, I'd have no probloem chalking up his struggles to said injury.


In breaking news, Kevin Youkilis just sent a shot off Dan Haren's pitching arm and he's out of the game.

[4bronxbombers]

WEEI mentioned today that NESN's ratings are way down this year (like 36%)... radio ratings are also down by quite a bit.

I'm just reading about that in the Courant today. I wonder why. Bandwagoners finding other interests?

[mentalgidget]

I'm just reading about that in the Courant today. I wonder why. Bandwagoners finding other interests?

You had the Bruins and Celtics making playoff runs into May (June for the C's). Add early season struggles for the Sox and they have been behind the 8-ball ratings-wise from the get-go. It has also hurt that, since the Celtics have finished, the Sox have been trotting out a (bad) Pawsox lineup. Kind of tough to generate excitement with Darnell McDonald, Daniel Nava, Kevin Cash, and Bill Hall in your line-up every night
Now they are in real danger over the next few weeks. if they don't get hot, they have no shot at gaining any traction this season with the Pats starting up in 2 days
To add to all of that, I do think Theo's "bridge period" comments from Spring Training resonate with people. To casual fans, that was probably taken as a bit of a white flag before the season began.

[Yankee Fan in Boston]

You had the Bruins and Celtics making playoff runs into May (June for the C's). Add early season struggles for the Sox and they have been behind the 8-ball ratings-wise from the get-go. It has also hurt that, since the Celtics have finished, the Sox have been trotting out a (bad) Pawsox lineup. Kind of tough to generate excitement with Darnell McDonald, Daniel Nava, Kevin Cash, and Bill Hall in your line-up every night
Now they are in real danger over the next few weeks. if they don't get hot, they have no shot at gaining any traction this season with the Pats starting up in 2 days
To add to all of that, I do think Theo's "bridge period" comments from Spring Training resonate with people. To casual fans, that was probably taken as a bit of a white flag before the season began.

Yes, this is a good assessment. I think their was less enthusiasm before the season even started (the infamous "bridge," but also the "run prevention" thing, after failing to sign a bat, really fell flat), and the combination of the early season struggles and the C's and even the B's catching people's attention didn't help either. I am sure Theo learned a lesson -- I am sure he'll be offering a much more rosy forecast next Winter/Spring.

[yanksphan]

WEEI mentioned today that NESN's ratings are way down this year (like 36%)... radio ratings are also down by quite a bit.

Did they mention Henry's tweeting down 100% this season also?

[YankeePride1967]

Did they mention Henry's tweeting down 100% this season also?

I think it has something to do with his "Curse of the Teixeira".

[Mr Coffee]

In breaking news, Kevin Youkilis just sent a shot off Dan Haren's pitching arm and he's out of the game.

Was it a baseball or a thrown helmet?

[False1]

Did they mention Henry's tweeting down 100% this season also?

Haw! Nice one.

[Eschie]

I'm just reading about that in the Courant today. I wonder why. Bandwagoners finding other interests?

Maybe this is why they never signed black players?

[S2]

With one pitch, Victor Martinez gets one more RBI than Cash, Molina and Brown combined.

http://twitter.com/GordonEdes/status/19621909216

[WaltKowalski]

I didn't put words in your mouth, I was poking fun at the douchey writers who keep pegging him as some sort "ace."

Just curious, but what's your definition of an ace?

[PirateChief]

I hate LAA. 0-6 this year against Boston. Disgusting team.

[blumj]

I hate LAA. 0-6 this year against Boston. Disgusting team.

It's kind of like watching the Red Sox play themselves, you know someone's going to do something stupid or sloppy whenever the game's on the line, you just don't know who or what, but you're pretty sure a bad relief pitcher is going to be involved somehow.

[MFLE]

Does no one remember that they swept the Sox out of the playoffs last season?

[S2]

Does no one remember that they swept the Sox out of the playoffs last season?

They had John Lackey last year.

[Yankeeah]

More importantly, the Red Sox had Papelbon