Honestly, that makes the most sense if we're planning on having Gardner play significant time. Granderson plays great defense but Gardner is pretty elite in the field. My only concern was that I don't really like having Granderson bounce around too much and that it would mess up his rhythm. If the three starters are going to be Granderson, Gardner, and Swish... that D makes the most sense.
that's pretty much what girardi also said about bouncing granderson around between LF and CF, so my guess is it turns on whether gardner can show he's a bona fide starter in terms of hitting. he's looked overmatched like he did at the end of last yr, but apparently he kicked butt today. if he can show some plate consistency, i agree it would be nice to maximize his D.Originally Posted by DaBliz
How have you determined he's looked over-matched? He's probably had 10 televised ABs this spring.
The coming of The Carpenter.
“I love to hit. I want to hit .300, .400, .500. I just love to hit.”
i actually think gardner has looked more overmatched at the plate this spring, but that's not to say that granderson has been lighting it up either... from what i've seen, both haven't been particularly good in the early going
not a science, that's just how it's looked to me in the half dozen or so at bats i've seen, kind of a continuum from the end of last season, overmatched and very slappy. so it's not a "determination" or conclusion or prediction, and i hope he turns it around as he did today.
I have a feeling we are going to regret trading Austin Jackson.
tigers fan here. granderson will win you 3 or 4 games this year with his glove. he will crank plenty of homeruns with that short right field. his intangables cant be messured. You will be very happy with his production. He always starts slow and gains as it warms up outside.
You do realize Jackson has holes in his game and that his ceiling is Granderson? But yes, we'll see this brought up a million times throughout the season and I assume, it'll be the same group of people.
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Hell, I'd say Granderson is well beyond what Jackson's ceiling is. Granderson has far more power than Jackson will (even if Jackson's power develops, which is far from a given at his age), and Granderson's skill set exceeds that of Jackson. Jackson's a tremendous athlete, but he has tons of holes in his game - the lack of power, the high strikeout rate, the mediocre OBP, etc. And that shiny .300 average he put up last season was inflated by an extremely high BABIP, which means that .354 OBP is higher than it should be as well.
1923•1927•1928•1932•1936•1937•1938•1939•1941•1943•1947•1949•1950 1951•1952•1953•1956•1958•1961•1962•1977•1978•1996•1998•1999•2000 2009 27-TIME WORLD CHAMPIONS
The high BABIP talk is crap. Jackson has always had a high BABIP, you can't just explain it away as luck. Jackson doesn't exactly have zero power either, he hit 10 HRs in 70 games and 9 in 130 games in 2007-2008. Just because he took a step backwards in 2009 doesn't mean he has no power, development isn't always perfectly linear.
The coming of The Carpenter.
“I love to hit. I want to hit .300, .400, .500. I just love to hit.”
Prediction: Granderson gets off to a slow start, Jackson gets off to a hot one, people in this thread will start say "I told you so!" about Jackson being better than Granderson.
By seasons end things will go back to normal and Granderson will be the superior player, and you'll never see those people again.
All good points, and AJax "might" eventually turn out to be a player comparable to Granderson and I'd be OK with that. I'd even be OK with the trade IF AJax ends up better than CG (very doubtful though). We are built to win now. And Granderson gives us much better odds to do so than AJax would. By far.
#27and still Counting.
To a certain extent, you're right, A-jax is a high BABIP hitter. However, it's unlikely he's going to be more than a .340 BABIP hitter in the MLB. This is because of the fact that very, very few players are capable of annually posting BABIPs above .340. It would be unreasonable to say that A-jax has Ichiro like BABIP skill.
A-jax's BABIP last year was .384. He's due for a ton of regression. If he had even a .340 BABIP, his line would have been bad this past year.
Exactly. His BABIP in 2009 was abnormally high - at least 40 points over what you could expect. That's what bolstered that .300/.354/.405 line. And considering he's not going to BABIP .340 in the majors (almost no one does, unless he were to become a lefty slap hitter like Ichiro), you're looking at an even greater regression.
Also, regarding his power, there's little question that it really isn't there. The only season where he's had an SLG over .420 was 2007, and that's because he mashed in his half season in Tampa. Even earlier that season in Charleston, he couldn't hit for power at all. Now, at the time, almost everyone thought that what he did in Tampa was evidence that his power was developing. But if you look at what happened in the 2 seasons after that, it quite clearly wasn't - he had a .419 SLG in 2008 and a .405 SLG in 2009. The only real evidence he's ever really shown of hitting for power was a half season in Tampa. Will it progress beyond the 4 HR he hit last year? Of course, but I can't see him ever hitting for power well - there's just been little evidence of it happening, and he's at the age where his power should be emerging, if not already there.
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Thanks for the good info, Mike.
will add on. I was short on time last time I posted. Granderson is a self made player. he will climb the fence in center and has a nack for stealing home runs to left center. He has done it to end the game a few times. He gets up for the big moments and has that extra gear most players dont have. He is made for the playoffs and playoff runs. The better the opps the better he does. His problem last yr was he was moved around the order and the tigers 7-9 guys couldnt hit at all. He is a center fielder. He can make the great catches in all directions and rarely misses a ball if he can get his glove on it. plus he can make up alot of ground due to quick jumps more than speed. He isnt a blazer at all but is a very smart baserunner which is why he can steal bases. In detroit he was the king of the triple. just check out his triple numbers. he is a gap hitter when he is on. Thats pull and away to the gaps. He starts rallies. dont worry about the lefty numbers he is the type who will work to make any hole in his game better. Great work ethic. His parents are both teachers and his desire is to be the best.
Thanks. What's your take on why the Tigers dealt him and then found money for Damon.
#27and still Counting.
Mike, thanks so much for the info on Granderson. I'm sorry Tiger fans had to lose a favorite player...
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A fool and his money can throw one heck of a party!
it was about the arms we got in that trade. otherwise it would have been a 2 team deal and grandy would still be a tiger.. yes grandy is his nickname..
I do think AJax was an overrated prospect but he did have a very level swing that produces a lot of LDs.
Coupled with his legs, AJax shouldn't have problems sustaining BABIP over .340 even at the MLB level. Probably not .380, but .340 sounds reasonable to me.
I think .340 is too generous. Mabe .330.
Players who annually have BABIPs of .340 are some of the best hitters in the league. A-jax is not this.
I think Granderson is going to get off to a terrible start, but will rebound nicely.
I could see that happening, hes going into the season with some new tweaks in his swing and theres still a big difference between testing that in ST and trying to do new things at the plate against live pitching in the regular season. Hes to good a hitter though for him not to settle in eventually though.
But Im sure that wont stop him from getting booed and having to hear "We want Damon" chants at yankee stadium.
If you listen to the fans you’ll be sitting with them soon enough.- Brian Cashman
Haha.
He struggles in the cold? He'll fit right in as a Yankee!
Win one for The Boss.
They really need to kick out fans who boo like idiots, especially the first few days into the season. Teix was booed in like the 3rd home start.
A fool and his money can throw one heck of a party!
...on his way to 40 HRs?
After his first big strikeout against a lefty, the papers and fans will be looking for his head.
I think that is a little too optimistic. But, 10 triples, 20 doubles and 30 homers would be reasonable and quite the hat trick....on his way to 40 HRs?
By All Star break we will have forgotten all about Damon. Granderson is a no brainer.
And personally I hope Damon suffers a power outage playing in Comerica.
When asked if the Red Sox would've beaten Tampa Bay in the ALCS had Manny not gotten his wish and been traded, Ortiz replied: "Probably. I'm not gonna lie to you."
Granderson crushed a double off of Hamels (A LEFTY!) today in the first inning.
To left center field too, it was a thing of beauty.
Granderson is very capable of reaching the 60 XBH you predict. He's averaged 67 in his 4 full season. The only time he failed to reach 60 was 2006 when he had 59. That was his first full year in MLB.
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Cano, Tex and CC are definite in that conversation. Even Mo to some extent.
"I see Jesus Montero as a potential once-in-a-generation force on offense."
also walked against Hamels.
"First batter up well here's the pitch: it's a curve. Second batter up because the first got served"
I am telling you grandy is a gap hitter left center and right center that is why he gets more triples than anyone in baseball.also walked against Hamels.
Playing in one of the best triples parks in the MLB also helped
In NYS he'll have fewer 3B and more 2B than in Comerica. Hopefully he'll have more HR as well.
Diplomacy is the ability to tell a man to go to hell so that he looks forward to making the trip
i'll be more than happy if he hits 25 homeruns with an plus .340 OBP.
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the eyes have it:
http://newyork.yankees.mlb.com/news/...=.jsp&c_id=nyy
Looks like Granderson will be in CF and Gardner in LF:
http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/yanke...uPQvtSxeqvn8eM
I know a lot people won't like this move but I think its the right one especially when you look at the longterm future of our OF. Gardner could be a 1 year fill-in player in which case Granderson would probably have to switch back to CF if we brought in full-time LF such as Carl Crawford next year. Also I like the idea of keeping the established player comfortable. It can't be easy to learn a new position while moving to a new team and doing all of this under the limelight. Plus its not like we can't switch them later on in the season anyway.
I didn't think much of it before ST, but after watching them two, it's clear to me Gardner should be in CF.
Calmer than you are.
we'll be trading for a LFer by the deadline, so this makes sense
Agreed. Gardner's value to the Yanks is significantly diminished in LF.
Diplomacy is the ability to tell a man to go to hell so that he looks forward to making the trip
Not if he can get on base at a .360 or better clip and swipe 50 bags with an 80% success rate.
I'm not sure he can do those things but if he can he has great value in either LF or CF.
Baseball is life;
the rest is just details.
Or Montero will be up playing the OF. Just get him some playing time out there in the minors and call him up.
It's unlikely he'll have a .360 OBP and more likely that he'll have an OPS in the low .700's. As such he's easier to replace as a LF.
Diplomacy is the ability to tell a man to go to hell so that he looks forward to making the trip
Yes that goes without saying, I'm just saying IF he gets on at a .360+ clip he adds a lot of value with his speed.
Baseball is life;
the rest is just details.
On the Yankees, Gardner can't get by without much power. OPS is very valuable, I'm not going to dispute that but it matters less for Gardner on this team. When you have a bunch of guys that can hit 20+ homers, it's good to have a guy like Gardner that has great speed on the basepaths. The main thing of importance is his OBP. If he gets on base at acceptable clip, we have guys up and down the lineup that can drive him home. If the OBP is up there, he definitely can score 100 runs.
I agree, this makes the most sense. If Montero can't play defense at catcher well enough to get by in the major leagues, then moving him to LF would be the best move for the Yankees going forward.
I would MUCH, MUCH, MUCH rather have Montero play LF for the Yankees for the next 6 years on the cheap than pay top dollar to watch Carl Crawford decline without having ever hit 20 HR.
If he can catch, great - that makes him Posada's replacement. If not, left field it is.
If Gardner can post a .370 OBP or higher, with his speed he'll be valuable. Any less than that and you're talking about an easily replaceable hole in the lineup.
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