First of all to begin with they gave him a terrible 4 year deal which wasnt worth it. Now theyre going to 2 years after he was just the worst catcher in all of baseball last year ? But yet they were cheap with the best pitcher ever, one of the best hitters ever and a good CF?
Not to mention they alos gaver Schilling a contract last year when he was clearly hurt. Now whats the difference between Schilling and Tek and Manny, Pedro and Damon? Hm I wonder ?
Huh? Did they sign Varitek?
They upped the offer to 2 years.Originally Posted by YankeePride1967
Wow, how many dollars per?
Do you just think of random stuff and post threads about it or is there a method to your madness?
You mean the same Manny they gave an 8 year contract to with 2 team options, the same Pedro they gave a 7 year contract to plus exercised a team option for 2004 a year before they had to that was worth $17.5 million, and the same Johnny Damon they originally signed to a 4 year contract?
There's no dollars mentioned here:
http://www.projo.com/redsox/content/...3.21a3385.html
Just a wild guess:And with reports out yesterday that the Red Sox had offered Jason Varitek a deal with a dual option for a second guaranteed year, the team comes closer to filling that hole every day.
- Varitek has to reach certain performance milestones for the option to vest. If he's benched or stinks it up, it's a 1-year deal
- Probably we're not talking about much money here
- Sox need a catcher badly, and won't trade Bucholz for Salty.
On Damon, Cashman swooped in and played it brilliantly. Can't really fault Theo on Pedro - Mets got stuck with a pretty bad contract. The Manny thing has been talked to death elsewhere, so let's not talk about that here.
I think they wouldn't sign Damon because Boston is widely known as a hairist city.
"I'm sorry Smokey, you were over the line, that's a foul....mark it zero Dude, next frame"
I hope they keep Tek, it makes them a weaker offensive team...
Palmer killed Billy Mays
Hmmmm... Manny too... you may be on to something
"Trade a player a year too early rather than a year too late" -- Branch Rickey
where to start?
First, you chastise the Sox for giving Varitek a "terrible 4 year deal" yet, at the same time, you chastise them for NOT giving long term contracts to Pedro & Damon. which is it? Are they dumb for going long term with Varitek, or horrible humans for not going long term with Pedro & Damon?
Pedro wanted 4 guaranteed years, the Sox didnt want to give hime 4, they were skiddish about giving him 3 as it was. Damon got 4 yrs guranteed. Varitek may be getting 2 years guaranteed... that's a huge difference, especially considering the $$ involved in each situation. I havent seen any concrete numbers written about this offer to Varitek but one can safely assume it's in the 5-7 million / yr range while Damon and Pedro each are (were, in Pedro's case) getting around 13 million / yr.
They may sign Varitek for 1/2 the time and 1/4 the money and you think they made a major concession to Varitek and screwed Damon & Pedro?
Ah, dammit! I want pancakes! God, do you people understand every language except English? Yo quiero pancakes. Donnez moi pancakes. Click click, bloody click pancakes!
-- Stewie Griffin
so wheres the part where they offered him 2 years?
Schilling and Tek took/would take 1-2 year deals and the other guys all wanted longer contracts? Any other stupid and insulting questions?
Did you really play that card?
"... a dual option for a second guaranteed year..."
What exactly does that mean?
Worded strange, but I guess it's one of those options that either both or either/or have to exercise for it to happen.
Team and player option, I imagine. Either can opt-out
"Trade a player a year too early rather than a year too late" -- Branch Rickey
usually known as a "mutual option"
Mutual options are so incredibly pointless.
I don't even understand what the "card" is?
and to answer the question, how about the facts that it's late January and they could kind of use a catcher and we have no idea what the economics of the deal entail? Had any of those guys been up for a 2-year contract at low money, I'm sure the Sox would have jumped at it...
The only thing i can think is that it means the 2nd year becomes guaranteed if Varitek meets certain incentives (probably based on games played & ABs & probably very attainable); if he fails to meet those incentives, it becomes a club option.
That would be my guess
Ah, dammit! I want pancakes! God, do you people understand every language except English? Yo quiero pancakes. Donnez moi pancakes. Click click, bloody click pancakes!
-- Stewie Griffin
That's the thing, though -- that phrase could have a number of meanings -- contradictory meanings. Not just the dual option part, but also the "guarantee".
Anyway, if there is a club option on the 2nd year, it's not really a concession, is it?
The only benefit there could be to Varitek is if the buyout is sizable, but I doubt it. Mostly, club options are to the benefits of the club.
That the Sox offered deals to Tek & Schilling who are white. But didn't offer anything to Manny and Pedro and who are Latin and whatever the hell Damon is. Even though they're all completly different cases he grouped them all in the "Boston is a racist franchise" card.
Hahahahahahaha.
This forum should institute a waiting period for your new threads, where a mod has to give their approval for everyone to be subjected to these questions.
1) I think giving Varitek two years is dumb.
2) His situation is nothing like the other players you mentioned. Committing two years to a player at a low AAV means that if he continues to decline, the Sox can just cut him. It's a lot easier to eat 1/$5M than it is to eat a $13/14 owed to a player like Damon/Pedro.
3) Would you care to clarify that question I quoted?
Isn't Damon part Asian? I guess that's what threw me off -- I don't think he's Hispanic, and the Sox seem to be OK with Asian players. And other Latin players.
But other than that, and the lack of similarities between the contracts, it appears the point is spot on...
Is there necessarily a buyout attached to a club option?
I though Damon was Native American, doesn't matter anyways this is a dumb-ass thread.
Not automatically, but most do. I would imagine in Varitek's case if there is one, it isn't much more than half a million.
What it is, it's not uber-white, so there.
I hope this thread is being locked right now so I show up as being in after the lock.
Geez.
"Metallica. Screaming crowd. Jog to the mound. Game over." -C. Jennings
Of course, Manny was still under the team's control for two more years at which time he would have been 38. So, I guess the Sox are racist for not wanting to just tear those two years up and guarantee him more money till he was 40 or 41.
As for Pedro, they were afraid he was going to fall apart and didn't want to go past two years. They were probably afraid of paying him 25 million for a year with 29 innings pitched and another year of 100 innings at a 5.61 ERA. Thank goodness for Pedro, the Mets aren't racist.
Oe thing they ALL have in common...the Sux were/would be correct to
let all of them walk away rather than meet their "number of years" demands.
Varitek for two years? Bad move, Epstein.
Get 'er done.
"I'm sorry Smokey, you were over the line, that's a foul....mark it zero Dude, next frame"
Sabermet, don't let the haters get you down. Don't ever change, man.
That second year better be under the club's control.Oe thing they ALL have in common...the Sux were/would be correct to
let all of them walk away rather than meet their "number of years" demands.
Varitek for two years? Bad move, Epstein.
Get 'er done.
Dual Option means the option is able to be acted on by both sides, but that it does not have the same value.
The Team Option will likely be 5-6-7 million
The Player Option will likely be half of whatever the team option is.
yeah, that was my 2nd guess
Ah, dammit! I want pancakes! God, do you people understand every language except English? Yo quiero pancakes. Donnez moi pancakes. Click click, bloody click pancakes!
-- Stewie Griffin
OK. Thanks, that makes sense.
Foulke had that.
Pedro and Mannys original deals are irrelevant because they were still in their prime. But they werent willing to payback guys like Pedro or Damon but did with Varitek.
Now personally I agree with not getting Pedro cause I dont beleive in paying guys back but why pay back a scrum like Tek but not a great pitcher like Pedro? Clearly Pedro in 04 was m uch better then Tek npw or even Tek in 04.
I guarentee Tek ends up being the most revered guy from the title teams which makes sense in a city like Boston.
But they were willing to pay for Damon and they even offered more money than they should have for Pedro - the Mets just upped it.
As for Manny, that doesn't even make any sense. But then again, neither does this thread.
http://www.weei.com/
$5M guaranteed for next year, $5M team option/$3M player option for the year after, possibly plus incentives. And a deadline.
You do understand we're talking about different money here, right?
It would have taken 40 million to "pay back" Pedro. They offered Varitek 5 million with the chance for 5 more.
As for the second point, unless David Ortiz murders somebody, I think I know who the "most revered" award will go to.
Responding to him is pointless. Sabermet is having a conversation with himself.
Thought there was news to be had on this thread. Instead it's a poke at the Red Sox through implied racism toward departing FA's?
FAIL
"I see Jesus Montero as a potential once-in-a-generation force on offense."
Thats only because the sox have Ortiz at a cheap price. Once he becomes a free agent and the sox dont pay him the FO will trash him to high heaven, the fans will eat it up like the sheep they are and then Tek will be numero uno.
Sab just quit....
Guaranteed money to past their primes aging players aside...
00000000100000000000100000000001
It is what it is but it ain't what you think
I say we stomp him! Then we tattoo him! Then we hang him! And then we kill him!
I say we let him go.
Nice job by Boras convincing him to decline arb, and probably a 1/$10MM deal.
It wouldn't even shock me if Boras convinces him to turn this down, too.
Cuz I am... the Rain King!
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