Why can't cashman make-up a package to trade for Grady Sizemore?Originally Posted by Babe Rules
Yes
No
Why can't cashman make-up a package to trade for Grady Sizemore?
Well, yeah. If the #9 hitter isn't the last one to bat, the #1 hitter gets an extra ABThere is an 8/9 chance that he gets 1 more PA than the #9, and that's assuming the #9 doesn't get pulled for a PH.
The big thing about being the leadoff hitter is the people behind you and in front of you. People in front of you probably aren't getting on base (#8 & 9) that often. People behind you get hits. You job is to get on base, steal second if it's a single/BB and get home off the #2/3/4's bat.
The idea is clump the good hitters together. It's kind of silly to have a good bat backed by 2 bad bats three times. Remember the whole "timely hits" thing? You need the hits to come in the same inning- and the best awy to do that is put the best hitters next to each other.
A fool and his money can throw one heck of a party!
I haven't thought of that.
Because it would be to many people let's see it would probably take Hughes, Cano, Jackson for them to even consider it and then we'd probably have to add in 2 more people.
Still and will always be a New England Patriots fan.
The leadoff hitter's job is to get on base, we agree. We don't know if Gardner can do that well enough. Beyond that, I really don't know what point you're trying to make.Well, yeah. If the #9 hitter isn't the last one to bat, the #1 hitter gets an extra AB
The big thing about being the leadoff hitter is the people behind you and in front of you. People in front of you probably aren't getting on base (#8 & 9) that often. People behind you get hits. You job is to get on base, steal second if it's a single/BB and get home off the #2/3/4's bat.
The idea is clump the good hitters together. It's kind of silly to have a good bat backed by 2 bad bats three times. Remember the whole "timely hits" thing? You need the hits to come in the same inning- and the best awy to do that is put the best hitters next to each other.
A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.- Barry Manilow
I went with no, although if they do make a major splash with CC/AJ/Pettitte for the rotation I'd reconsider. You have to figure Posada and Cano will bring more production in '09. I don't think we'll go another season with a 68 OPS+ from centerfield. A-Rod hopefully continues his trend of good year followed up by great year and goes off in '09.
All that said, I still think that unless it gets ridiculous that the Yankees should not pass up on a chance to sign Tex. He changes the whole dynamic of the lineup.
Please come back to us. I hope this post is some sort of perverted joke...
"I see Jesus Montero as a potential once-in-a-generation force on offense."
My hair is hurting, reading this thread... Sheesh, guys. Cmon now. The Yankees aren't going to sign any "big" bats. They are putting all of their money into the pitching basket and want to REDUCE payroll. CC and either Burnett or Lowe will be it. We already have our firstbaseman in Swisher. This is the team they will go with. No Manny, no Tex, certainly no Sizemore. Cashman wants to retain the kids and won't trade them en masse for Grady Sizemore. I am not saying that I agree with this. I would have rather seen them sign Texiera for first rather than Swisher. They could have signed Tex, CC and Lowe and still would be under last year's budget. I think they are coming to the realization that pitching and situational hitting wins pennants, not slugging. They are probably right, but I think that the trade for Swisher was a mistake. You don't want guys striking out at the rate that he does, even with his OBP. If he hits .219 again, or anywhere close to that, I don't think his OBP will make up for it. I guess we shall see...
Then I guess you just saved me some time in watching baseball. If the Yankees aren't even smart enough to go after offense which is far more important to the team especially since in 2008 our hitting went so badly. We needed an extra jolt to our team. What makes 2009 better then 2008? How do help our offense? How do we even make the Playoffs? Well guys there's always 2010.
Still and will always be a New England Patriots fan.
FYI for all those people who think we were a bad team this year
We were a healthy Wang away from making the playoffs.
Thats it. If Wang was healthy IMO we make the playoffs no questions asked.
I voted no, but some people are over reacting when it comes to this teams short comings.
Short comings? Come on! Our future kind of rid on having a good first baseman. Who's gonna be better at first then Tex? Swisher? Jeter? Posada? Any dumb manager could have signed Tex because he would know it would make our team better. Swisher at first base if anything is gonna make our team worse. I've said it before and I'll say it again Cashman dug his team into big hole and it's gonna take a lot for them to dig themselves out.
Still and will always be a New England Patriots fan.
I'll be disappointed if they make no other moves to improve the offense, but I'll hold out hope that they can get it done. This offense right now is nothing to brag about, but if the pitching shapes up in a best case scenario way, it should be good enough to get to the playoffs.
Win one for The Boss.
Can't we at least trade for a young power hitter? I'm not talkin grady or anything. But would it that much to ask for a young power hitter so we could at least.......... I don't know how do I put this? WIN?
Still and will always be a New England Patriots fan.
Right now it seems they are hoping the pitching is so good they don't need top notch hitting. I think they COULD be right, but like I said, they'll need everything to break in a "best case scenario" way. If they sign CC, Burnett and Lowe, and then CC gets off to a slow start, Burnett misses 10 starts, and Lowe is Andy Pettitte Pt. 2 for us, the offense could easily be too weak to cover that up.
Win one for The Boss.
I don't care who our pitching is they could have CC , Halladay, Johan Santana, Cy Young, and the great Roger Clemens(In his prime) and if 2008 was any example they would still lose thanks to the offense. I can't tell you how many times I have seen the Yankees lose by 1 or 2 runs or simply go down swinging against a poor to average pitcher. That's not gonna change unless the yankees do something about it and that unfortunately isn't what they are doing.
Still and will always be a New England Patriots fan.
But you are being irrational. In 2008 they were missing their starting DH for most of the season, their second baseman was playing like crap, their starting catcher who is a big time hitter missed basically the entire season, their starting SS played half the season injured, their HOF 3B missed 20 games or so, they got ZERO production out of CF, and they had one of the streakiest players in history (exaggeration) at 1B. On top of it all, they had horrendous luck with RISP. I think they are bound to be a better offense next season, if only marginally.
Win one for The Boss.
Last year was a worst of all worlds for the Yanks offensively. I won't bother going into all the reasons, we know them all. There is no reason to think that the collective offense will be as bad as last year. Swisher is a mild upgrade assuming he returns to past production. If we have decent pitching, and CMW will be a huge welcome back, we should be a contender. Now we just have to sign the pitching.
"Only dull people are brilliant at breakfast."
Also: To all the mediots who actually bought into the "we're into defensive metrics now" Sox meme? You're morons.
It just makes me sooooo mad that Yankees are basically putting a red ribbon on Tex and almost handing him to the Angels or Boston for Christmas. Pitching is good but you need to have good hitting and good pitching . 1 or the other isn't really gonna help us. I just don't get how we don't get a great 1st base. Swisher probably won't be that much better then Giambi at first base.
Still and will always be a New England Patriots fan.
You're jumping to conclusions. I think that CC is priority 1A and the Yanks don't even want to think about Tex until CC is delivered. They know Boras clients drag the signing process out, so why tip their hand whether they are in or out at this early stage? They want to get priority #1 out of the way and then I can see them making a push for Tex.
I'd agree with that if I hadn't heard from Cashman himself in a quote saying he signed Swisher for first base and so he didn't have to get Tex. Unless this is a mind game for Boston and the Angels. I 'm gonna have to say they aren't going after Tex.
If they were going after Tex. Cashman wouldn't have said that they signed Swisher to play first so they didn't have to sign Tex.
Still and will always be a New England Patriots fan.
I can assure you he never said this. He may have said "Swisher is our 1b as of right now", which is utterly different.
Yeah. and Cashman also stated that one thing he really loved about Swisher was his versatility.
Lance Berkman is a Yankee!! Finally a Rice U. guy on the team!
we need pitching, but I could live with trading matsui for a young hitter... maybe even sign milton bradley if we traded away a matsui/melky package for avg. pitching.
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If we have lights-out pitching, then maybe our offense as we know it today IS good enough. Right now, though, we have the famous two guaranteed started: Wang and Joba. If this poll is up after CC, AJ Burnett, Lowe, Peavy, Pettitte, Moose have made their respective decisions, it will be easier to know whether we need to score 1000 runs or 800 runs next year.
"You don't play the games on paper....you have to play the games."
--Derek Jeter
Its possible, but you can't feel good about going into this season with an offense that produced runs at a very inconsistent rate last year minus two of your better hitters with only Nick Swisher and perhaps better health to replace them regardless of what our pitching staff looks like.
I really feel like we need a consistent bat like Teixeira who can put pressure on the opposing pitcher and keep our lineup productive. Then with Swisher in the OF we have some depth in case their is injury. Right now if any one of our starters goes down including injury prone guys like Matsui, Damon, and Posada we're going to have a bottom of the lineup that includes Gardner and someone like Melky, Molina, or Cody Ransom. Then think about if ARod goes down for any portion of the year. Someone like Swisher or Matsui would then become our cleanup hitter. Too much would have to go right for this offense to be championship caliber regardless of who is pitching for us. And are we really willing to put the fate of this team in the hands of a guys like Burnett who have trouble staying healthy or Lowe who was terrible in the AL east his last go around.
You know what It could have been something like that. But, I really don't think that going after Tex is their plan. Let's think about this for a sec Right now they are looking for CC Lowe and Burnett and Pettitte to be Yankees . Do you think Tex fits in there anywhere? That's about 5 free agents right there with adding in Tex.
Still and will always be a New England Patriots fan.
We need Tex or Manny. If we don't get either, we're not making the playoffs, book it. A-Rod as our no. 3 won't cut it, he needs some protection. If Cash decides he doesn't want to unload big$$ on Tex or Manny, then by all means bring back Bobby with a much shortened salary. I'll b very weary if we go into the season with Swisher, Cano, or even A-Rod in the 3 hole.
Its great that the yanks want to load up on pitching but they have to realize that while they are going nuts on pitching, our once fearsome lineup is deteriorating more and more every year due to age and players leaving. They need someone to anchor that lineup with A-Rod and nobodys better than Tex on the market.
If you listen to the fans you’ll be sitting with them soon enough.- Brian Cashman
Remember we can still trade for a big hitter if we don't get Tex or Manny. Maybe that was their plan all along.
Still and will always be a New England Patriots fan.
That's the truth. I am feeling more positive about Tex recently. I thought Cash had clearly shut the door on the possibility a couple of days ago but a couple of folks who post here have changed my mind. I could see the Yanks' FO going all-in on CC knowing that Tex (with Boras) will probably be a time consuming process, no need to rush or tip our hand.
"Only dull people are brilliant at breakfast."
Also: To all the mediots who actually bought into the "we're into defensive metrics now" Sox meme? You're morons.
I would much rather lock up a young CF that could hit via trade than acquire Tex. As it stands, we have a hole somewhere and that hole is in CF right now. If we were able to finagle a deal to close that problem up, we'd be good. We have four corner outfielders, two of which can play first. We can afford to lose any one of them if we get the right player back.
Even now, things are being a little pushed out of proportion. Everyone on this team outside of CF can hit right now. We're going to be able to score runs, period.
Who did you have in mind?
Still and will always be a New England Patriots fan.
A lot of people thought the same thing going into last season and that was with Abreu and Giambi penciled in every day. We ended up scoring 200 less runs last year than the year before with those 2 guys, I dont want to think how many less runs we will score without them.
If you listen to the fans you’ll be sitting with them soon enough.- Brian Cashman
We have a long term solution at CF and that is hopefully Austin Jackson. We also have a short term solution in CF and that is moving Swisher or Damon there. Both while at best average at the position are capable of playing there. Both along with Nady are also great corner OFs. An OF of Damon, Swisher, and Nady overall is probably average defensively.
Yes, defensively Swisher is better suited to play 1B. Offensively though he is well below average. Of the 25 qualifying starting 1B this year (at least 400 ABs) Swisher was 22nd in OPS this year. If you go by his career OPS of .805 he would've been 18th and if you go by his best year (2006- .865 OPS) he is still slightly below average at 14th. Looking at CF's though he ranked 15th of 22 in 2008, his career numbers would've put him at 8th, and his 2006 numbers would've put him in 4th. So barring a down year he is above average offensively as a CF while below average offensively as a 1B.
Teixeira this year ranked as the #3 1B in terms of OPS with a .962 mark better than any qualifying CF. The highest that any CF put up was .901 by Josh Hamilton. The guys who are regarded as the top CF's in the game: Sizemore and Beltran were tied for 2nd with an .876 OPS. That is equal to what Giambi put up this year and would be good enough for only 8th among 1B. Simply put there isn't a CF in the game that can produce at the level that Mark Teixeira can offensively. The Yankees would be wise to take a slight hit defensively by putting Swisher in CF where his bat plays much better when compared to positional averages.
Good offenses aren't necessarily composed by having above average (relative to the position) hitters at every position. Not in my opinion, anyways. I feel like if we can have solid hitters at every slot in the lineup, regardless of position, we'll be pretty set. The thing is, right now we're looking at Melky or Gardner in CF and both are abominations at the plate. I'm not against putting Damon in center but the offense still seems frail considering the amount of injuries we had last year and general age of the team. If we could sale off one of our older, currently more productive players, for a younger player that is more likely to stay healthy, I'd do it. Then you could sign a liability like Baldelli to be the 4th outfielder and I think our offense would be pretty decent.
As far as the young player that could be that CF, I was thinking DeJesus or maybe Chris Young. Austin Jackson won't be ready until later in the year, if at all, but even if he could play next year, it'd be nice to have another young player out there with him.
With the starters totally up in the air it could be plenty or extremely lacking. Ask again on April 1.
Let the kids play.
When Nady Reverts to his career line (sub .800 OPS) he'll be a well below average corner outfielder. I'm hoping he is not a regular next year, with a trade this offseason being the most desirable outcome.
Alex Rodriguez
Career OPS: .965
Postseason OPS: .977
Even though some fans strongly disliked them at times, Giambi and Abreu were pretty productive and were decent options to plug into the 3 and 5 holes surrounding ARod. As of right now I have no clue who we'd bat 3rd (please don't tell me Matsui) and I'd rather not have Nady protecting ARod in the 5 slot.
So no, we need Teixeira or need to make a trade to get a middle of the order hitter.
.
Of course, the more presents under the tree, the better. Gimme, gimme, gimme ...
But given a limited, albeit high budget, the real question at this point, I believe, is whether the Y's should make a big hitter or a second starting pitcher their second priority after C.C. I believe strongly that the big hitter should be the second priority.
Sure, this lineup could be good enough if folks stay healthy and produce at the upside and if the starters also stay healthy.
But to maximize the potential for success, I would much rather have the Y's get a big bat to protect ARod and compensate for the loss of what Abreu and Giambi brought at their best as Yankees than have them sign A.J. or Lowe to go along with C.C.
By big bat, I mean Tex, Holliday, or Manny, or someone else at that level.
I would argue that Manny might be a little bit better offensively at least but other then that you are right. If we don't sign Manny or Tex. Cash better work up a major deal and drag away a big powerhitter via trade.
Still and will always be a New England Patriots fan.
There are very salient reasons why the offense can be just as bad/worse than last year and they have been enumerated in this thread.
- We lost 2 0.800+ OPS hitters in the line-up.
- Jorge was declining before his contract year and is coming off injury.
- Jeter is not getting any younger.
- Damon has had a good year, bad year, good year, so it's not a sure thing he's going to repeat last year at another year older.
- Matsui has knee problems and has only played 1 full season in the last 3.
I think Cano just got fat and happy with the new contract and he'll bounce back next year. But outside of that, there's a lot of mileage on the players. You can say last year was bad luck, but I tend to think probability kicked in. When you depend on very young or very old players, you're basically counting on certainty from high risk elements.
Offensive Upgrades:
It is pretty clear that the 2008 Yankees suffered defensive as well as offensive struggles. They played sub-.500 baseball against lefties and they would mysteriously get shut down by mediocre righties like Kyle Davies and Scott Feldman. This team lacked balance, depth and flexibility.
I feel quite confident that Swisher, Matsui, Posada and Cano will give us substantially more than they gave in 2008 (in the case of Swisher, he will easily outproduce the weird mix of Betemit, Duncan, Ensberg and Sexson).
That being said, this team needs to be able to produce enough runs to go head to head with a reinforced Rays squad and a Red Sox team that could include Mark Teixeira.
The teams needs to have a good lefty-righty balance as well as defensive versatility and durability.
Assuming we cannot sign either Manny or Teixeira, what would you like the 2009 Opening Day lineup to look like?
-if you have separate lineups for LHSP and RHSP, include both
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Not good enough last year, not good enough this year.
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I disagree. Last year the Yanks scored 789 and allowed 727 (more than any playoff team excpet CHW who allowed 729 and was 1/2 a game worse than NNY by record).
That split an 87-75 X WL which was was almost identical to their actual record of 89-73.
I think this year's team can easily match the 789 runs scored (an probably exceed that IMO) but I think this year's pitching staff should be able to shave off about 0.4 runs per game or about 65 over the course of the season for a total of 662 allowed which would give an X WL record of 94 - 68 which is usually good enough to get to post season.
Would they be better with another big bat? Of course but what will that look like in 2 or 3 years when then are once again an aging team limited roster flexibility?
Baseball is life;
the rest is just details.
So much seems to hinge on Damon, Matsui, and Posada and whether or not they can stay healthy. Also, which Robinson Cano will we get? If it's the one who challenges for a batting title...we're OK...Not Great, But Decent...
If it's the Robinson Cano of last year...Ugh.
Defense wise, The guy has a complete noodle for an arm, and with all of this talk about acquiring Manny...I never thought as a Yankee fan that there would be a day where we would possibly have Manny in Left and Damon in Center. Yuck...I just threw up in my mouth a little.
I may not have been the best Yankee to put on the pinstripes, but I am the proudest. ~ Billy Martin
I don't like Matsui protecting ARod.
Matsui is "streaky" and can goes cold as ice at times.
If something spooks Arods' confidence during the season while Matsui is cold we're finished.
Yes everyone goes hot / cold...
But not everyone has ego, confidence, look mom I'm relaxed, please like me problems.
AROD NEEDS A ROCK PROTECTING HIM ! a solid hitter with his numbers spread evenly throughout the season
We can't afford to have a number "8" batting 3 or 4 during the playoffs (again)... followed by someone who's hitting like a light switch.
Peter Gammons drinks Boston toilet water thereby causing him to talk sh*t from time to time... Schilling has obviously given up his Sam Adams for it. f**k boston.
I agree with this. I'd love to get Tex, but if we even just replace the dynamic Gardner/Melky duo with Cameron I think we are more than good enough to get into the playoffs, and that our pitching could take us far in the postseason.
"Trade a player a year too early rather than a year too late" -- Branch Rickey
I just think it's asinine to expect Swisher, Cano, Posada, and Matsui to all bounce back this year, which is what will probably be needed to make this offense a good one.
A hitter like Tex or Manny would make things easier for me, hell, I would even take Dunn (that wasn't a shot at him, I like him).
If our pitching holds up, we have enough offense to win. That being said, it could use a boost.
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Statistically, I think it's pretty likely that Swisher and Cano are going to do better. Posada walking onto the field is pretty much "bouncing back" -- all he has to do is provide more than Molina did last year. If we add Cameron into the mix as an upgrade over our putrid hitting in CF last year, I think we can at least match last year's production. And while we didn't score 1000 runs last year, we did score more than our division winner.
"Trade a player a year too early rather than a year too late" -- Branch Rickey
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