Offseason Minor League All Purpose Prospect Thread

[bmxstreetrider86]

To be fair, I don't think (or hope) AM2 was trying to say Masterson was the better prospect, he just has better ground ball tendencies. After all its not even close with Horne having four plus or near plus pitches to Masterson's one.

he is saying that masterson stats from AA were better than horne's, which as a statement is certainly defendible.


though i think he should revisit his point about masterson tiring late in the season because the same thing would be said for horne

[NY_GOLDENARMS]

he is saying that masterson stats from AA were better than horne's, which as a statement is certainly defendible.

For 58 AA innings, its a very poor defense but certainly a defendible comparison.

[ARoDfan4life]

To be fair, I don't think (or hope) AM2 was trying to say Masterson was the better prospect, he just has better ground ball tendencies. After all its not even close with Horne having four plus or near plus pitches to Masterson's one.

in what world can this even be debateable, damn Peter Gammons has people believe too much

ok AA stats since we're using AA samples

in 58 IP of (AA) Masterson's H/9 7.60
in 153.1 IP coming off TJS (AA) Horne's H/9 8.75

if people really think about it Horne in double the innings off TJS had double production to Masterson, Masterson also comes w/ big question marks his sinker being the only real plus pitch his change up questionable, his slider raw, control has been an issue plus the fact he was shut down last season. I don't mean to rain on parades but did the Red Sox fans forget it was Alan Horne who won the Eastern League Pitcher of The Year ?, he won it for a reason.

[NY_GOLDENARMS]

in what world can this even be debateable, damn Peter Gammons has people believe too much

ok AA stats since we're using AA samples

in 58 IP of (AA) Masterson's H/9 7.60
in 153.1 IP coming off TJS (AA) Horne's H/9 8.75

if people really think about it Horne in double the innings off TJS had double production to Masterson, Masterson also comes w/ big question marks his sinker being the only real plus pitch his change up questionable, his slider raw, control has been an issue plus the fact he was shut down last season. I don't mean to rain on parades but did the Red Sox fans forget it was Alan Horne who won the Eastern League Pitcher of The Year ?, he won it for a reason.

I'm not sure if you were commenting on what I wrote but the only thing debatable between Horne and Masterson on this planet we call earth is that Masterson has better groundball tendencies in the 153 innings he pitched last year.

[ARoDfan4life]

I'm not sure if you were commenting on what I wrote but the only thing debatable between Horne and Masterson on this planet we call earth is that Masterson has better groundball tendencies in the 153 innings he pitched last year.

yeh I was using his AA stats to Horne's I forgot he pitched A ball last season, but that is pretty much it , Masterson has more groundball tendency than Horne who seems more like a swing and miss guy. NY it wasn't directed at you.

[Jonny]

True enough, but Jeff Marquez induces more ground balls than Horne does, and his BABIP was a perfectly normal .303.

Not last year. It's been well documented that he wasn't getting as many GB outs. Who knows what the reason was; I hope he was just working on his secondary pitches.

Agreed. In the EL:
Masterson
K/9: 9.2
BB/9: 2.8
GB%: 68%

Horne
K/9: 9.7
BB/9: 3.3
GB%: 51%

Like I said, statistically speaking Masterson was better in 2007. Not the other way around.

58 innings is not nearly enough to be significant. Horne had the better year.

[YASS]

Not last year. It's been well documented that he wasn't getting as many GB outs. Who knows what the reason was; I hope he was just working on his secondary pitches.

According to minorleaguesplits.com, Horne had a 213/210 G/F ratio last year; Marquez's ratio was 280/240.

[Jonny]

Hmm, milb.com is showing different numbers.

[YASS]

Hmm, milb.com is showing different numbers.

milb.com shows GO/AO, which is not the same thing, since it doesn't include all batted balls, only outs.

[keg411]

Masterson is a side-arming righty. Reading his stats is one thing. Actually seeing that motion is another. He'll be a reliever eventually.

As for Horne, he'd be a top prospect if he could get his walks down. Until he does, he's a #3 in a best case scenario and more likely a #4 or #5. Because even the really highly touted guys in the minors (Like John Lester of Homer Bailey) that walk too many are looking like back-of-the rotation guys.

[Jonny]

milb.com shows GO/AO, which is not the same thing, since it doesn't include all batted balls, only outs.

They show different stats for IP and other totals.

[YASS]

They show different stats for IP and other totals.

Weird. Missing innings.

Grain of salt, I guess, for all the minorleaguesplits.com numbers.

[Dynasties R Forever]

[74nole]

I find it curious that the stats looked at seem to be filtered. Example-Masterson/ERA 4.42 in AA for 58 IP. Horne-omitted. (ERA 3.11 in AA for 153.1 IP-led EL for SP, K/ 165-led EL, I understand they're just stats--but if that's what you're looking at...
Oh yeah, their head to head stats Trenton vs Portland are pretty interesting, too.

[Dynasties R Forever]

True enough, but Jeff Marquez induces more ground balls than Horne does, and his BABIP was a perfectly normal .303.

As I said, the infield defense is certainly a factor, but it's clearly not the sole factor.

Hey YASS, where did you get that avatar from? Where you get to put your name on the McDonalds sign. That's awesome pop culture, I want one so bad.