Was the Yankee offer to Torre Fair?

[Zimmers' Helmet]

I voted that it was not a fair offer. Had he not just have managed the team for 12 basically successful seasons, that deal is a very nice one, but in this particular case and in these particular circumstances you have to think it was an orchestrated PR move to try and win over the public opinion.

This is not a new technique deployed by Steinbrenner & Co. They used the exact same approach with Buck Showalter after the end of the '95 season : Make 'em an offer they have to refuse.

[TheBamTino24]

This is not a new technique deployed by Steinbrenner & Co. They used the exact same approach with Buck Showalter after the end of the '95 season : Make 'em an offer they have to refuse.

Right. And Showalter was more akin to Torre than any other manager of the Steinbrenner Era. Showalter had put in 4 years, the previous record for longevity.

[Yanks4eva1]

I depends what you mean by fairness.

Remember, no one put a gun to the Steinbrenner's head to offer Joe Torre $7M to manage this team.

Once you give a person that amount of money, then you cut his salary and add incentives that are really stupid and one that is a virtual crapshoot, then yes it was unfair.

You're adding an incentive of $1M to get the team to the postseason. That's BS. He's done that for 12 freaking years. The other incentives are stupid and no amount of money would be worth all that pressure. No money is worth it. He's not God. If there is a catastrophic injury to a major player in 2008, what's he to do?

The Steinbrenners are once again showing their true colors. They have no people skills and they are on the verge of ruining this team once again. They know how to make money, no doubt, but their business acumen when it comes to emotional intelligence and dealing with people - well, they are failures. Frankly, they are a stupid bunch.

Their "do it now" reactive personality (really, it's George and it seems the apples haven't fallen far from the tree) ruined this team back in 1981 when he got rid of Reggie Jackson. Now we are doing it all over again. Ugh. The end of an era occurred yesterday, ironically on the 30th anniversary of when the other Yankee era began - Reggie hit those 3 HRs in WS game 6, 30 years ago yesterday.

What they did to Torre was a shame. Do they actually think anything good can come out of this disgraceful way of ending Joe's tenure with the Yankees? The players will start to think - if they can do this to Joe, what will happen when my time comes?

Class - that belonged to Joe Torre. Now he is gone, the Steinbrenners are showing who they really are, and frankly who they have always been. We've gone back from class to crass in a single day.

Welcome to my old world, spoiled Yankee fans (those who became fans during the Joe Torre era).

Hate to be Chicken Little today, but I've been a Yankee fan long enough to see the signs.

Dee

[Zimmers' Helmet]

I depends what you mean by fairness.

Remember, no one put a gun to the Steinbrenner's head to offer Joe Torre $7M to manage this team.

Once you give a person that amount of money, then you cut his salary and add incentives that are really stupid and one that is a virtual crapshoot, then yes it was unfair.

You're adding an incentive of $1M to get the team to the postseason. That's BS. He's done that for 12 freaking years. The other incentives are stupid and no amount of money would be worth all that pressure. No money is worth it. He's not God. If there is a catastrophic injury to a major player in 2008, what's he to do?

The Steinbrenners are once again showing their true colors. They have no people skills and they are on the verge of ruining this team once again. They know how to make money, no doubt, but their business acumen when it comes to emotional intelligence and dealing with people - well, they are failures. Frankly, they are a stupid bunch.

Their "do it now" reactive personality (really, it's George and it seems the apples haven't fallen far from the tree) ruined this team back in 1981 when he got rid of Reggie Jackson. Now we are doing it all over again. Ugh. The end of an era occurred yesterday, ironically on the 30th anniversary of when the other Yankee era began - Reggie hit those 3 HRs in WS game 6, 30 years ago yesterday.

What they did to Torre was a shame. Do they actually think anything good can come out of this disgraceful way of ending Joe's tenure with the Yankees? The players will start to think - if they can do this to Joe, what will happen when my time comes?

Class - that belonged to Joe Torre. Now he is gone, the Steinbrenners are showing who they really are, and frankly who they have always been. We've gone back from class to crass in a single day.

Welcome to my old world, spoiled Yankee fans (those who became fans during the Joe Torre era).

Hate to be Chicken Little today, but I've been a Yankee fan long enough to see the signs.

Dee

Perfectly stated in every aspect.

[yankeesAZ]

This post keeps popping up in some form or fashion around here and it reeks of ignorance.

Let's run a hypothetical here.

If A-Rod got offered $25 million by the Angels for 5 years and the Yankees said ok, here's an incentive laden deal. We'll offer you $28 million dollars for the same duration PLUS an incentive based on playoff performance that could get you $50 million a year, he'd jump all over it.

Free agents get all sorts of incentives all the time. Torre would be the highest paid manager in baseball with INCENTIVES to get him to DOUBLE the amount of the next highest paid manager. Any free agent would take that deal.

Let's offer A-rod a one-year deal with incentives and see how fast he takes it. After all it will show him how much we "want" him like they did with Torre. Do you really believe they wanted Torre to stay with that kind of offer?

[Mantle'sMutt]

I depends what you mean by fairness.

Remember, no one put a gun to the Steinbrenner's head to offer Joe Torre $7M to manage this team.

Once you give a person that amount of money, then you cut his salary and add incentives that are really stupid and one that is a virtual crapshoot, then yes it was unfair.

You're adding an incentive of $1M to get the team to the postseason. That's BS. He's done that for 12 freaking years. The other incentives are stupid and no amount of money would be worth all that pressure. No money is worth it. He's not God. If there is a catastrophic injury to a major player in 2008, what's he to do?

The Steinbrenners are once again showing their true colors. They have no people skills and they are on the verge of ruining this team once again. They know how to make money, no doubt, but their business acumen when it comes to emotional intelligence and dealing with people - well, they are failures. Frankly, they are a stupid bunch.

Their "do it now" reactive personality (really, it's George and it seems the apples haven't fallen far from the tree) ruined this team back in 1981 when he got rid of Reggie Jackson. Now we are doing it all over again. Ugh. The end of an era occurred yesterday, ironically on the 30th anniversary of when the other Yankee era began - Reggie hit those 3 HRs in WS game 6, 30 years ago yesterday.

What they did to Torre was a shame. Do they actually think anything good can come out of this disgraceful way of ending Joe's tenure with the Yankees? The players will start to think - if they can do this to Joe, what will happen when my time comes?

Class - that belonged to Joe Torre. Now he is gone, the Steinbrenners are showing who they really are, and frankly who they have always been. We've gone back from class to crass in a single day.

Welcome to my old world, spoiled Yankee fans (those who became fans during the Joe Torre era).

Hate to be Chicken Little today, but I've been a Yankee fan long enough to see the signs.

Dee

Dee speaks with an articulate and accurate sense of history. I tend to have a bit more optimism that common sense and at least some of the recently gained tacit if not institutionalized power in the GM will help to ward of the Levine types in the long run and after the dust settles. That said, the idea that some of these, shall we say, less than qualified bufoons, may be jockeying for power and/or looking to smake a splash are disconcerting. And, though it does seem that the Yankees have more accountability than in previous purges with a comparitively sound Boss, but you make a very good case with respect to "seeing the signs". I am sure it is a subject about which you'd love to be wrong.- so good for you, too.

[nycdoc999]

It will not be Showalter if the Yankees want to keep Rodriguez...

[nycdoc999]

They need to get Levine away from the microphone. He is here only to oversee the new stadium construction - a deal which he helped broker b/c of his political connections. He is a smarmy, slimy sort - one who really should not be involved in any on-the-field decisions....

[TheScooter]

Is life fair?

Torre walked from the best job in professional sports because his feelings were hurt

The Yankees have paid him $21 million the last 3 years and they haven't won a playoff series.Not the World Series.A PLAYOFF SERIES

Shouldn't Torre held accountable for those results?This is not a trip down memory lane

The highest manager in the game can't get his team out of the first round

Eric Wedge made a $1 million in 07

Tito is making $1.65 million this season and I'm supposed to feel sorry for Torre who turned down a guaranteed $5 million.................please

Tito has playoff based bonuses in his contract

Terry Francona Manager
2 years/$4.05M (2007-08)

• signed extension 3/06
  • $0.65M bonus at signing ($1.25M total for 06)
    
  • 07:$1.65M, 08:$1.75M
  • bonuses for making playoffs, winning LDS, LCS, World Series

http://mlbcontracts.blogspot.com/200...n-red-sox.html

Not Mr.Torre.His head and ego have gotten too big for his own good

[fredgmuggs]

What is fair? The Yankees thought it was fair and Torre thought it wasn't fair. End of story... it's all a matter of perspective.

[nycdoc999]

Let's see if the Red Sox low-ball Francona and cut his base salary by 30% if he doesn't win the WS this or next year....

I bet they don't. I bet they don't offer him a 1-year guarantee on an extension - which is less than what any new, UNPROVEN manager would get.

If you can't see why that's "wrong", I can't help you....

[Zimmers' Helmet]

Is life fair?

Torre walked from the best job in professional sports because his feelings were hurt

The Yankees have paid him $21 million the last 3 years and they haven't won a playoff series.Not the World Series.A PLAYOFF SERIES

Shouldn't Torre held accountable for those results?This is not a trip down memory lane

The highest manager in the game can't get his team out of the first round

Eric Wedge made a $1 million in 07

Tito is making $1.65 million this season and I'm supposed to feel sorry for Torre who turned down a guaranteed $5 million.................please

Tito has playoff based bonuses in his contract

Terry Francona Manager
2 years/$4.05M (2007-08)

• signed extension 3/06
  • $0.65M bonus at signing ($1.25M total for 06)
    
  • 07:$1.65M, 08:$1.75M
  • bonuses for making playoffs, winning LDS, LCS, World Series

http://mlbcontracts.blogspot.com/200...n-red-sox.html

Not Mr.Torre.His head and ego have gotten too big for his own good

Yeah his ego..., how would you react if after working for your employer for 12 years, and helping make your company more profitable than it's ever been; your boss were to call you into the office tomorrow morning and tell you that if you want to continue your employment there, that you will have to accept a 23% pay cut.

Yeah, Im sure you won't feel insulted or offended....give me a break.

[trentonthunder]

I won't know if this is "fair" or not until I see what the Yankees do with
their money from here on out. Perhaps a new era is unfolding where the yankees
spend less on proven commodities, and rely more on less expensive, unproven ones.

Are the yankees saying here that they are tired of overpaying for failures ?
Or are they saying that they are tired of Joe's "failures" the past 7 years ?

I'm still not sure how to read this. It will be interesting to see what happens
with Arod, Mo, and Po. Then I will see a little more clearly.

[TheBamTino24]

So far the results are a split. Just like the question about firing Torre.

Polarizing indeed.

[Giuseppe Franco]

So far the results are a split. Just like the question about firing Torre.

Polarizing indeed.

Which means they handled it poorly. It shouldn't be hard to garner an 80% approval rating for how one handles a somewhat controversial firing of an executive.

When you can't get support merely for your handling of a situation like this from many of the people that AGREE that he should be gone you know you handled it poorly.

[nnysiny]

it was a fair contract. they could have easily told him to walk and not offered anything. seems Joe, like Bernie, thought he had a lifetime contract, and felt insulted when it turned out that he didnt

[ToneinTO]

It was a fair deal. At some point you have to move on and live in the present instead of dwelling on the past.

On a different note: When Torre replaced Buck Showalter, the NY media (and many Yankee fans) mocked him, calling him "Clueless Joe," and ridiculed the Yankees' front office for getting rid of Showalter, who had taken the Yankees to their first postseason appearance in 14 years.

We all know how Joe's first season turned out. He wasn't "Clueless" anymore after '96.

What I'm getting at is the sky is not falling, the Yankees have a very talented team and you never know, their new manager might be able to get them to perform better in the postseason.

I was a Yankees fan decades before Torre and I will stay a Yankees fan now that Torre is gone. After the repeated playoff disappointments of the last few years, it's not the end of the world that he is leaving.

[ARoDfan4life]

absolutely fair

[whalers]

Yeah his ego..., how would you react if after working for your employer for 12 years, and helping make your company more profitable than it's ever been; your boss were to call you into the office tomorrow morning and tell you that if you want to continue your employment there, that you will have to accept a 23% pay cut.

Yeah, Im sure you won't feel insulted or offended....give me a break.

I'd be happy to still have a job if I had failed so miserabley at my job back in 2004.

[ToneinTO]

I'd be happy to still have a job if I had failed so miserabley at my job back in 2004.

Me too.

[Babe Rules]

The offer was fair, the way it was offered wasn't.

[StatenIslandYankee]

I believe whether or not we loved Joe, wanted Joe back, or wanted to move on from Joe, we can all agree on one thing and that is the approach that was taken was low class. Justify the offer all you want, but it's not about the money, it's about RESPECT and COMMITMENT. You don't want the guy, have the guys to simply fire him. Don't wiggle him around and because of a public outcry give him an incentive laden deal that you KNOW he will reject and on top of that give him a one year deal (lame duck manager situation). The Yankee brass handled this poorly to say the least. They have egg on their face, and it doesn't even seem like they care. Sad ... very sad. But the point is not if we want Joe back or not (feelings on his job and status aside), but on the political side. How they treated him and this situation was downright disrespectful and a real slap in the face.

[Metroidman]

Yipee another topic for people to argue in

[Sam18]

Yay thread!

[TheTinoMobile]

To start this thread.. or not to start this thread.. You should NOT Have started this thread.. it's completely pointless and your post could have gone in one of the 1000 other Joe Torre / manager discussion threads.

[JavyVazquezIsSick]

Question for me to poop on?

[In Mo I Trust]

To thread or not to thread?

[Hitman23]

tee hee...... this is getting hilarious.

[StatenIslandYankee]

Sorry for adding another thread, I'm just frustrated with how they handled this.

[a2ruYankee]

Sorry for adding another thread, I'm just frustrated with how they handled this.

They handled it poorly because the media is pumping that story.

He was offered 5 million. 3 more to win.

Not acceptable and walk away. He did.

Its done.

Its over.

"Every new beginning comes from some other beginnings end"

[wileedog]

Let's see if the Red Sox low-ball Francona and cut his base salary by 30% if he doesn't win the WS this or next year....

I bet they don't. I bet they don't offer him a 1-year guarantee on an extension - which is less than what any new, UNPROVEN manager would get.

If you can't see why that's "wrong", I can't help you....

Of course they won't, he won the division and beat the Angels at the very least.

Which is more than Torre has accomplished in 3 years.

And Francona is making 6x less then Torre anyway, why would they want to cut his salary?

[Bugg]

WE NEED MORE JOE TORRE THREADS! They're like tribbles.

[LIYanks]

Why should Joe feel insulted by the offer? He has not taken this team past the first round since 2004 and he is getting paid a lot of money to get us to the promised land.

Let Joe go. All good things must come to an end. And I doubt he will ever land another job that pays him as much as his last contract with the Yankees.

[StatenIslandYankee]

SHOCKED @ more 'fair' than 'unfair'

[longtimeyankeefan]

I think we all know that whether it be a manager or player, we are paid based upon what we did in the past and not for the current year. If Joe was underpaid those years, he more than made up for that from 02-06. His last contract was based upon his remarkable record through 2003. Since then the Yanks blew that 3-0 lead in 04 followed by three straight first round defeats with two of the three being sound defeats. Is it fair the manager seems to get most of the blame? Of course not but that's how things work. His 05-07 record, if he wanted to be paid based on performance when he got his last extension, warrants a slight decrease to where he would still be guaranteed to be the highest paid manager in the game. But as I believe you said in another thread, I think Joe felt the Yanks didn't want him back. We'll find out more later.

Exactly.

Most people who recognize my moniker would label me a Torre apologist, but I feel that this contract offer was very fair.

I equate Torre's current situation to the situation the Yankees were in with Bernie Williams when his contract expired. His productivity with the Yankees had clearly declined and the Yankees offered him an incentive laden contract with a huge decrease in base pay - much more so than what Torre was asked to take.

I don't blame Joe for not taking this contract - I can certainly see his point of view. He feels that his performance for the last 12 years speaks for itself - and it does. But his performance over the last seven years (particularly the last three years) also speaks volumes.

Eventually, an organization has to move in a new direction when the production of a major contributor begins to decline. It was time for the Yankees to move on from Joe Torre and now they have.

[gregzzy22]

No and if you believe other wise, Randy Levine and everybody who made that offer did their job.

[apalradio]

While it seems fair, considering the number, the pay cut aspect as well as the one year deal, combined with the "incentive clause" made it totally unrealistic. Has this team ever succeeded in their hardass approach to personnel decisions? The offer was disingenuous. Worse yet, the organization is now being run by three Steinbrenners, not just one!!!

[cyhughes22]

It was a degrading slap in the face to a man who deserved much better. Randy Levine and his croneys have a lot to answer for in this life and the next. Treating Joe Torre this way is despicable in and of itself but when you couple that with what looks like manipulating a momentarily lucid George Steinbrenner to try to get what you want there's a lot more than a baseball move at the core. They've brought a ton of shame and tarnish onto this organization with this cold, calculated and infinitely stupid move. They need to remember that we all reap what we sow.

[AJW]

I'm not a huge Torre supporter but I think it wasn't so much the offer but it was how they made him wait. I'm sorry to see Joe go. I don't think we will ever see a Yankee manager like him again. He was so good with dealing with multiple personalities within the clubhouse, the pressure from Steinbrenner and also dealing with the media. Joe was one of a kind.

[Murcer1]

I didn't like the whole tenor of the contract. You either believe in him or you do not. You offer him a multi-year deal without silly incentives or say you're going in another direction.

Don't give me this one year stuff with this nonsense of putting a carrott in front him of him for the posesason. The guy has been here for 12 years. That's an insult...like he wasn't trying, or "motivated" as Levine alluded to. Yeah, he wasn't motivated. This freaking overpriced team was 21-29 and he got them back.

And you guys really think it's fair to put the manager in a spot where he could burn out young pitchers for incentives? WTF? Or pay him a $1M for winning 3 ALDS games?

I think we should instill paycuts on Wang, Rodriguez, and Jeter, too. Let them reach their full salary per round of the postseason.

I would have told them to shove it face to face as well. You have to have some dignity in life, and Torre has accomplished enough and has enough resources to do so.

Here's the kicker: I would have voted "fair" if he declined a guranateed a 2 year, $10M deal.

I couldn't have said it better myself. You are 100% on target.

[MunsonNY15]

I didn't like the whole tenor of the contract. You either believe in him or you do not. You offer him a multi-year deal without silly incentives or say you're going in another direction.

Don't give me this one year stuff with this nonsense of putting a carrott in front him of him for the posesason. The guy has been here for 12 years. That's an insult...like he wasn't trying, or "motivated" as Levine alluded to. Yeah, he wasn't motivated. This freaking overpriced team was 21-29 and he got them back.

And you guys really think it's fair to put the manager in a spot where he could burn out young pitchers for incentives? WTF? Or pay him a $1M for winning 3 ALDS games?

I think we should instill paycuts on Wang, Rodriguez, and Jeter, too. Let them reach their full salary per round of the postseason.

I would have told them to shove it face to face as well. You have to have some dignity in life, and Torre has accomplished enough and has enough resources to do so.

Here's the kicker: I would have voted "fair" if he declined a guranateed a 2 year, $10M deal.

There was no need to read further into this thread. TBT summed it up perfectly, IMO.

Heidi

[sjb23]

Fair? Yes
Honest? No

Here's my whole take, for what it's worth:

If the Yankee organization would've handled this differently, it could have accomplished many many good things, not only affecting 2008, but for several years thereafter. My guess is that ownership had no problem with Torre managing the club in 2008, but didn't want him managing in 2009, for a number of reasons. Why not be upfront with Joe, and tell him that? Tell him his role in 2008 will be to help ring out the old and bring in the new for 2009. Help Mattingly get ready to take over the ship in 2009, help the veterans and the younger players get used to the idea that things have to change, that the Yankees will reward winning and not settle for anything short of it. I think Joe could have accepted this, because he has always asked for the truth, and he wants to feel needed. He's a realist, and knows his job won't last forever. He'll be 69 in 2009 - what a perfect way to ride off into the sunset! He'd have nothing to lose and everything to gain. His legacy will have a storybook ending and he will be remembered for being a mentor as well as the winningest manager in Yankee Stadium history. Oh and by the way, Joe, we're going to re-sign Posada and Rivera and A-Rod and give you another chance at getting that fifth ring.

The club finally has a crop of young pitching prospects that can really help make the club a powerhouse when they open up the new stadium. But they have to hold onto them, and help them grow and mature in 2008, in a town that will easily grow impatient as these pitchers go through inevitable growing pains. Say what you will about Torre, but he is a player's manager, and even the younger players like Chamberlain, Cano, Cabrera, and Wang are singing the praises of the leadership and tolerance that Torre and his staff show. Who better to teach these players how to stay even-keeled and focused, even in a city that can be the most distracting?

The organization must think about marketing and public relations, both now and covering the next few years. They publicly state that the team goal each and every year is to win a championship, knowing that of course it's impossible to do that -- but it's committment to winning certainly helps sell tickets, sparks interest, and creates revenue. I'm sure that sometime in 2008, they will begin selling those club suites they so badly wanted more of. My guess is they'll be selling them for more than one season at a time and will charge exhorbitant prices for them.

They have to put Don Mattingly in a position where he can be successful in 2009, because they can't afford for him to NOT be successful. If he has another year to mentally prepare for his new role, it can only help him -- I don't think they feel he is ready to take over in 2008.

All they had to do was be honest and offer him a guaranteed $7M for 2008 only. I think Joe Torre would have appreciated it and accepted it.

[Sillycon]

It was a degrading slap in the face to a man who deserved much better. Randy Levine and his croneys have a lot to answer for in this life and the next. Treating Joe Torre this way is despicable in and of itself but when you couple that with what looks like manipulating a momentarily lucid George Steinbrenner to try to get what you want there's a lot more than a baseball move at the core. They've brought a ton of shame and tarnish onto this organization with this cold, calculated and infinitely stupid move. They need to remember that we all reap what we sow.

geez, with your comments, you'd think Levine butchered Torre's family. Perhaps not the best way to go about this in regards to the contract but your reaction is WAY over the top.

[Carlton Fisk]

In my opinion, the offer was insulting, they offered him a contract that they absolutely knew he wouldn't accept, just so the organization could say "We made him an offer, he turned us down, Joe's the bad guy here".

Even as a Red Sox fan, I've always had the greatest respect for Joe Torre. Most Sox fans do, he got a standing ovation he got when he came back to Fenway after his battle with cancer.

After 12 years and all that he has accomplished he deserved far better treatment from the Yankee organization than he got. Was it time for him to go at this point? Probably, it's been a long run and with all the young players coming up it is a good time for a change and most likely Torre knew that too.

The sad thing is all of this could have been avoided if the Yankee Brass called him to Tampa a few days after the ALDS loss and said, "Joe, we're going in a different direction. How would you like to go out?" This way there would be fewer hard feelings on both sides and no reason to save face.

For all the Torre bashers, be careful what you wish for, because this could go either way. I don't think any other manager could have brought the Yankees out of the gutter that they were in after May.

[wardsp]

But the Yankees have been pretty consistant with their message, that the manadate every year is to get to the World Series. They have never wavered from that and Joe knew, very well, the terms of his employment - realistic or not. So according to the terms he acknowledged, he did not meet exprectations for 7 years in a row. That certainly warrants both a pay cut, a short term deal, and incentives.

If the Yankees hadn't ever explicitly made this the context of his 7 million a year, than Joe would have a right to be upset. As it stands, the offer was more than fair and Joe Torre should have taken the deal, gotten to the WS and proven he is the winner he insists deserver to be paid more than 5 million a year.

[#9]

I'm a Torre hater and I know that it wasn't fair. But then again, neither is life.

[wileedog]

Yeah his ego..., how would you react if after working for your employer for 12 years, and helping make your company more profitable than it's ever been; your boss were to call you into the office tomorrow morning and tell you that if you want to continue your employment there, that you will have to accept a 23% pay cut.

Yeah, Im sure you won't feel insulted or offended....give me a break.

If I had failed at my employers stated mission statemetent for 7 straight years, I would be pretty happy he was still offering me more than anyone in the else in the world to do my job.

You're right though, its about ego. Torre - and obviously many other people here, doesn't believe he has failed the past 7 years or the past 4 in particular. Its obvious he thinks what he did 96-00 warrants lifetime employment, and utmost faith from management.

The Yankees obviously feel differently, and many others of us don't blame them. From the Yankees standpoint, given their shaky opinion of his recent job performance, the offer was more than fair.

I still don't believe it was an 'offer he won't accept' plan. Kay on ESPN said he talked to a lot of Yankee Brass, and they wanted him back for a year, probably to give Mattingly another year to transition. But I don't think there was any way there were going to guarantee a 2nd year other than a WS, and that's what Torre wanted more than the money.

[Carlton Fisk]

World Series visits are a great goal, every successful team has to have them.

But you either have faith in your manager or you don't, tying the contract to the incentives is not fair to the players or the manager because now that is going to be the conversation hanging over the team all season long.

IMO, the Yankees could have offered him a 9MM guaranteed contract for one year and he would have turned it down. Conversely, had the Yankees offered him a 3 year/15MM he may have taken it. Yes it is a paycut, but it shows that the organization has faith in him and allows him to do his job.

I agree that it was time for a change. But it should have been handled better.

[The Q Bomb]

World Series visits are a great goal, every successful team has to have them.

But you either have faith in your manager or you don't, tying the contract to the incentives is not fair to the players or the manager because now that is going to be the conversation hanging over the team all season long.

IMO, the Yankees could have offered him a 9MM guaranteed contract for one year and he would have turned it down. Conversely, had the Yankees offered him a 3 year/15MM he may have taken it. Yes it is a paycut, but it shows that the organization has faith in him and allows him to do his job.

I agree that it was time for a change. But it should have been handled better.

Very well stated. I believe you captured the essence of Torre's objection.

[#9]

Very well stated. I believe you captured the essence of Torre's objection.

Typical Sox fan!