Protect our players thread

[OldYankeeFan]

I wasn't in favour of drilling Ortiz in the 9th either. I wanted to get one out, and then drill Manny. He puts on a much better show.

[yankeefreak04]

I kind of thought that he would get two outs (Youkilis and Ortiz) and then plunk Manny bringing a slumping Drew to the plate with one on... After he walked Ortiz, that threw that logic out the window because he wouldn't want to plunk Manny moving Papi to second thus bringing up Drew up with two on... At least that is what I hope he was planning...

[yankeefreak04]

I wasn't in favour of drilling Ortiz in the 9th either. I wanted to get one out, and then drill Manny. He puts on a much better show.

Ortiz would have made two outs... He had already retired Youkilis... If he would have gotten Ortiz out, there would have been two out, nobody on which I feel would have highly increased the likelihood of Manny getting drilled...

[fredgmuggs]

This must be the obligatory We Want Ortiz Knocked on His Butt thread that pops up during every Boston series?

[knickfan23]

I kind of thought that he would get two outs (Youkilis and Ortiz) and then plunk Manny bringing a slumping Drew to the plate with one on... After he walked Ortiz, that threw that logic out the window because he wouldn't want to plunk Manny moving Papi to second thus bringing up Drew up with two on... At least that is what I hope he was planning...

Thats my thing with the situation. The whole plan (assuming there was one) went right out the window the moment he walked Ortiz. The only chance you had to do it was when there were 2 outs and 0 men on. You do not intentionally hit Ortiz to bring up Manny with 1 out and a man on, especially if you have a guy like Farnsworth out there who has control problems. That's why you cant hit Manny there either. Now one may say..."Hey, no worries, we have Mo waiting in the pen." But why would you want to bring in Mo, who threw 27 pitches the previous night, into the game in a spot where the tying run would be on deck with 1 out.

I dont know when the Yanks are going to be able to find an opportunity to do it. It certainly wont come from the starting pitcher wearing #35 tonight.

[OldYankeeFan]

Ortiz would have made two outs... He had already retired Youkilis... If he would have gotten Ortiz out, there would have been two out, nobody on which I feel would have highly increased the likelihood of Manny getting drilled...

Yep, a brain fart on my part...meant one more out. Let me re-phrase

[OldYankeeFan]

I wasn't in favour of drilling Ortiz in the 9th either. I wanted to get two outs, and then drill Manny. He puts on a much better show

[yankeefreak04]

Yeah, when the inning started, I actually told my wife that the ideal situation would be to get two outs and then hit Manny in the back... Then I said, "of course he will probably walk Ortiz and then he won't be able to hit Manny."...

[OldYankeeFan]

Yeah, when the inning started, I actually told my wife that the ideal situation would be to get two outs and then hit Manny in the back... Then I said, "of course he will probably walk Ortiz and then he won't be able to hit Manny."...

LOL. Said the same thing to my son, except I said Ribs instead of Back.

[yankeefreak04]

LOL. Said the same thing to my son, except I said Ribs instead of Back.

You are probably more right with ribs than back... If Farns would have unleashed one of his good fastballs, Manny might not have had time to turn his back into it...

[YankeesMVPDJ2]

I wasn't in favour of drilling Ortiz in the 9th either. I wanted to get one out, and then drill Manny. He puts on a much better show.

LMAO

[ScubaSteve]

In this case their player was hit first, and we hide behind "he didn't mean to". When our player gets hit first, he clearly meant to. Protecting your players is the right way to go about it, unless another team does it of course.

These threads get more ridiculous every game, especially when we all seem to have insight to every player's intent or lack of control.

Then again, Piniero has been an enforcer his entire career......

[yankeefreak04]

I think last night it was pretty obvious that Proctor did not throw at Cora intentionally... Load the bases up on your very first pitch and bring the tying run to the plate... I don't think so... Piniero's pitch was in question... I am not saying he did it intentionally, but it sure didn't look like a pitch that just "got away from him"... I understand that we hit them first, but in NO WAY was that intentional...

[ScubaSteve]

I think last night it was pretty obvious that Proctor did not throw at Cora intentionally... Load the bases up on your very first pitch and bring the tying run to the plate... I don't think so... Piniero's pitch was in question... I am not saying he did it intentionally, but it sure didn't look like a pitch that just "got away from him"... I understand that we hit them first, but in NO WAY was that intentional...

I hear you. I think some people's (and my) point is that the attitude seems to be whether intentional or not a pitcher must protect his players, and yet we seem to begrudge the possibility of others doing it.

Hell, we won the game!

[KINGOFNY]

An errant pitch should find it's way to Fagcona's skull.

[smckdwn989]

In this case their player was hit first, and we hide behind "he didn't mean to". When our player gets hit first, he clearly meant to. Protecting your players is the right way to go about it, unless another team does it of course.

These threads get more ridiculous every game, especially when we all seem to have insight to every player's intent or lack of control.

Then again, Piniero has been an enforcer his entire career......

again you are missing the point of this thread. this isn't just about last nights game, this has been going on for years. it needs to change, ortiz and manny are too comfortable at the plate, an occassional brushback pitch is all i am asking for.

[OldYankeeFan]

again you are missing the point of this thread. this isn't just about last nights game, this has been going on for years. it needs to change, ortiz and manny are too comfortable at the plate, an occassional brushback pitch is all i am asking for.

I agree but we may have to wait for the Rocket's return to Fenway to see that happen.


But....if we have a good size lead around the 8th inning tonight and Bruney is in...one might just get away.

[knickfan23]

I think last night it was pretty obvious that Proctor did not throw at Cora intentionally... Load the bases up on your very first pitch and bring the tying run to the plate... I don't think so... Piniero's pitch was in question... I am not saying he did it intentionally, but it sure didn't look like a pitch that just "got away from him"... I understand that we hit them first, but in NO WAY was that intentional...

I can make the same argument for Jeter getting hit. I didnt think it was intentional at all. It just so happened that Jeter was at the plate and the ball tailed too far inside. Sure, it made some fun theater for me to say "oooh, they hit DJ" (which I actually did), but that was the end of it. It just seems that we have selective versions of intentional.

[yankeefreak04]

It is just a plain fact that we are constantly getting hit, intentional or not, and not firing back... Proctor did it once, he just made the mistake of throwing too high... An occasional pop to the ribcage or back of one of these guys will earn our pitchers a little bit more respect and our hitters a little bit more safety...

[yankeefreak04]

I can make the same argument for Jeter getting hit. I didnt think it was intentional at all. It just so happened that Jeter was at the plate and the ball tailed too far inside. Sure, it made some fun theater for me to say "oooh, they hit DJ" (which I actually did), but that was the end of it. It just seems that we have selective versions of intentional.

I see what you are saying and like I said, I have no way of knowing whether or not that pitch was intentional or not...

[In Mo I Trust]

I can make the same argument for Jeter getting hit. I didnt think it was intentional at all. It just so happened that Jeter was at the plate and the ball tailed too far inside. Sure, it made some fun theater for me to say "oooh, they hit DJ" (which I actually did), but that was the end of it. It just seems that we have selective versions of intentional.

I didn't think it was intentional either, it was what, the 3rd pitch of the AB? After he had thrown at least one off speed pitch. And I didn't want Kyle hitting anyone, the last thing he needs to do is give the Red Sox a free baserunner.

[silverdsl]

An errant pitch should find it's way to Fagcona's skull.

I don't care how much you hate the Red Sox, wishing injury on a player or manager, and name-calling of that nature isn't acceptable here.

[yankeefreak04]

I don't care how much you hate the Red Sox, wishing injury on a player or manager, and name-calling of that nature isn't acceptable here.

I agree 100%... That comment was way over the line... Nobody on this thread is calling for the head-hunting or injuring of any Red Sox players, least of all their manager...

[JeterRodriguezSheff]

I just don't get you guys sometimes. You get upset when pitchers hit your guys (intentionally or otherwise), saying that you need to protect your players, regardless of intent. Yet here, a Yankees pitcher hit a Sox player FIRST (which I believe was unintentional), which was then followed by a Yankee being hit (Which I felt was intentional), and now you are saying that is "crap?" Why wasn't it crap when it was being advocated after the yanks were HBP first?

There was no headhunting or anything else that might be considered bush league. It was a "you hit our guy, and we hit your guy, and now we are even." You guys need to make up your minds. Is it okay to retaliate when your guys are HBP or not?

Just like our justice system, INTENT makes all the difference. Its is alright to retaliate when it was intentional. If it was an accidental hbp, you should just suck it up and deal with it.

[Jglaubman]

Just like our justice system, INTENT makes all the difference. Its is alright to retaliate when it was intentional. If it was an accidental hbp, you should just suck it up and deal with it.

Even if it was accidental, the Yanks have to send a message saying if you are going to pitch inside to our players, be damn well sure you don't hit them or you will pay!!!

[smckdwn989]

you know what, it's just as much who they hit as anything else... and jeter is their target of choice... and quite frankly, i am sick and tired of it. meanwhile their main two guys still dig in without fear...

it's nothing personal, but I want ortiz to hit the dirt...

[DJ27]

it's nothing personal, but I want ortiz to hit the dirt...

Enter Roger Clemens!!

[Maris*61]

We are just starting to get hot and our bullpen is just starting to get rested. Wang and Clippard have given our pen a break over the past two games. Now is not the time to have any pitcher tossed out of a game. Just win this series, get Clemens and Hughes back and worry about retaliation later.

[Mark19]

An errant pitch should find it's way to Fagcona's skull.

What is wrong with you?

That is the dumbest thing one could do.

[smckdwn989]

for the last time, if farnsworth hit someone last night he wouldn't get ejected/suspended...

warnings weren't even issued....

[Yankeesfan811]

As much as I want to protect our players, you can retaliate every single time. the Yankee have more class than anyone in this league, and I would like it to stay that way.

[knickfan23]

I see what you are saying and like I said, I have no way of knowing whether or not that pitch was intentional or not...

And thats the thing though. I'm sure even the Yankee hitters are smart enough hitters to know when someone is intentional trying to drill them. When Pedro went upstairs on Karim in Game 3, he knew what the deal was. When Sheff got hit by him the next year, he stared back and said "Don't do that. Not to me!" He knew what the deal was.

Either the Yankee players are just used to and tolerant of it, because their actions and mannerisms toward Red Sox pitchers would leave you with the impression that they dont feel as if none of these HBP's are intentional. If they felt that way, as hitters, by human nature they would react very subtlely or give the pitcher a glare (Posada is known for this). To this point, I havent seen any of that. Therefore, I cant get up and arms if they obviously dont feel the same way.

[Meecham4ever]

Call me reactionary, whatever! Its absolutely absurd Ortiz wasn't hit, 1 out, bottom of the ninth up 4 runs. You aren't going to as many chances to send a message that your key guys are going to hit, when you hit our keys guys without much risk. Hitting Jeter was completely intentional, this team should be friggin ashamed they didn't retaliate.

EDIT: Futhermore, I couldn't care less if someone on the Sox gets hit tommorow or the day after, that was the perfect time to do it, to make a stand for once, but this team put its tail between its legs like it always does in these situations.

Joe should take a lesson from Francona....he didn't wait for days when one of his guys got hit, he plunked one of ours' the very next inning...WAKE UP JOE!!!!

[smckdwn989]

Joe should take a lesson from Francona....he didn't wait for days when one of his guys got hit, he plunked one of ours' the very next inning...WAKE UP JOE!!!!

sorry, the blame falls on the players just as much as the manager... sheesh, i know it's the cool and hip thing to blame joe for everything... but this isn't one of those situations

[Maynerd]

As much as I want to protect our players, you can retaliate every single time. the Yankee have more class than anyone in this league, and I would like it to stay that way.

Agreed. But, the low class retaliation is to put the ball behind the other guy's ear or knee. I wouldn't have minded walking Ortiz on four pitches that were all 6" inside. You don't need to put it in his ear or even hit him; you just need to push him back off the plate and get him to think about things during his next at bat.

[YASS]

Agreed. But, the low class retaliation is to put the ball behind the other guy's ear or knee. I wouldn't have minded walking Ortiz on four pitches that were all 6" inside. You don't need to put it in his ear or even hit him; you just need to push him back off the plate and get him to think about things during his next at bat.

I'd have no argument with this. I have always wanted to test, as a kind of science experiment, what would happen if teams decided to consistently move Papi back off the plate.

I think the real problem is that they're afraid it's just a little too easy to miss just a bit over the plate and leave it low and on the inside corner. We know what happens to those pitches.