New York bagels: Why so awesome?

[montyque]

I just returned from a 5 year absence from New York (well, from the Northeast in general)...

(pauses for applause, congratulations, kudos, e-housewarming gifts)

... and I'm rediscovering one of the world's great pleasures: The New York Bagel. Now, we all know that New York bagels are the best. But my question is why? Why is it that the bagels from the boroughs, Westchester and Long Island make everything else seem like Wonder Bread?

In Dallas, where I lived for the last 2.5 years, the Dallas Observer, a local "Village Voice" style freebie, cited the chain "Einstein Bagels" for "best bagels" in their yearly "best of Dallas" list. Sad thing is, they're probably right.

It's not the technical know-how... obviously L.A. has a zillion folks with the recipes in their blood since their Jewish forebears boiled & baked on the Lower East Side... and yet the best the city of Angels has to offer is Noah's Bagels, doughy messes which for some reason Californians seem to think are top-quality. And it's not even a Jewish thing anyway, anymore... some of the best-loved bagels in the city are made by Asian-owned bakeries.

I've heard theories about the water, same as pizza dough. But it just doesn't seem like enough to make a difference. Has anyone ever had a bagel outside of NY that was awesome? (Jersey doesn't count) The furthest away I've ever had a great one was a totally random diner in Poughkeepsie.

[Hitman23]

For pizza it's the sauce first and foremost. If the sauce isn't good the pizza sucks.

But the pizza is also affected by the dough, same as the bagels. I lived in Florida for 6 months and found this place that imported water from NY. (brilliant idea) They had the closest thing to NY pizza I found down there.

[chanman7483]

I think it has something to do with the minerals in the water and/or the hardest of the water.... that's what I heard from a deli owner.

[CoyoteYankee]

I think it has something to do with the minerals in the water and/or the hardest of the water.... that's what I heard from a deli owner.

Hardness... which is measure of magnesium and calcium in the water. (My job is water treatment).

I think it's definitely the water that makes the bagels and pizza dough taste so good.

[gdn]

It's all the spit.

[gamesix1977]

Must be the water and the general NY atmosphere!

[montyque]

Whatever it is, it's all good. Ever been down to Kossar's Bialys on the Lower East Side (BelDel, as the real estate people have dubbed "Below Delancey.") They're named for their bialys of course, but man, what a bagel. Any New Yorkers have favorite spots? I remember David's near Tompkins Square being great...

[destelle]

Whatever it is, it's all good. Ever been down to Kossar's Bialys on the Lower East Side (BelDel, as the real estate people have dubbed "Below Delancey.") They're named for their bialys of course, but man, what a bagel. Any New Yorkers have favorite spots? I remember David's near Tompkins Square being great...

mmmmm.... Bialys. One of my favorite things. I love introducing people to what I like to describe as a cross between a bagel and english muffin. Carb heaven for me.

I have never had a good bagel outside of this area. It's gotten to the point where I just don't try anymore. It's not worth it. I would have to think somewhere in America the water is similar to the NY area and they should be able to make a good bagel .

[Dr. Gonzo]

I think it has something to do with the minerals in the water and/or the hardest of the water.... that's what I heard from a deli owner.

yup, it is the water, at least that is what I was always told from people in the industry.

Good old LI cancer water

in college I would bring back dozens of bagels and a few pies to get me through, nothing is like new york dough

[wexy]

The water. I was visiting my friend in Knoxville and he asked me to bring him bagels. On the way to the airport, I bought a dozen and threw them in my carry on.
I had to switch in Atlanta for a flight to Tennessee and while boarding in Atl, the person behind me must've smelled the still fresh stuff and sighed "Bagels!"

[CoyoteYankee]

I have never had a good bagel outside of this area. It's gotten to the point where I just don't try anymore. It's not worth it. I would have to think somewhere in America the water is similar to the NY area and they should be able to make a good bagel .

There's no water like the water in Catskills which is where most of the water in NYC comes from. It's awesome water.

[fredgmuggs]

Like others have said already... it's the water. My wife is originally from Brooklyn and she used to bring back water from Brooklyn to wash her hair with because she swore no other water made her hair look as nice. Now that's loyalty..... or, vanity.

[montyque]

So... any favorite bagel places in the 5 boroughs?

[In Mo I Trust]

I imported bagels for myself when I went to college in Baltimore. The bagels there are terrible, a total disgrace. The bagels in Boston are mediocre. I can't seem to get a good egg sandwich outside NY/NJ either.

[YankeeClemens22]

So... any favorite bagel places in the 5 boroughs?

Ess-a-bagel. 21st and 1st. Nothing in the city can touch it. Hands down the best. They put H & H to shame.

[NYDCYankee]

I think the notion that it is the water is the trick is bunk.

Better ingredients and it's just made right. That's what it is. They don't make pizza that you have to fold in other area of the countries.

As far as bagels go, they make them big and foamy outside NY. No good.

[In Mo I Trust]

How annoying are those bagel chains people in other cities think are good? They aren't.

[THEBOSS84]

Ess-a-bagel. 21st and 1st. Nothing in the city can touch it. Hands down the best. They put H & H to shame.

Funny you should mention - I read in the NYPost the other day that they are being forced to shut down.

http://www.nypost.com/seven/12042006...ise_kramer.htm

[Hitman23]

People who live in New Haven CT are convinced they have better pizza than NY.

[fredgmuggs]

People who live in New Haven CT are convinced they have better pizza than NY.

Better pizza, I'm not sure about that. I'll let someone else judge what the best pizza is, but I will say this much.... I've had pizza from all over this country and New Haven's pizza is pretty damn good. And the white clam pizza from Pepe's is without peers.

[CptCrunch]

People who live in New Haven CT are convinced they have better pizza than NY.

It's to make themselves feel better for having to live in New Haven.

[Hitman23]

Better pizza, I'm not sure about that. I'll let someone else judge what the best pizza is, but I will say this much.... I've had pizza from all over this country and New Haven's pizza is pretty damn good. And the white clam pizza from Pepe's is without peers.

It is good, I agree. But I actually got into a heated battle with someone about it when I worked in CT. And everyone in the entire office backed him up. i couldn't believe it. They kept telling me that it origionated there. Even if that's true it's not proof.

[Hitman23]

It's to make themselves feel better for having to live in New Haven.

nice....

[fredgmuggs]

nice....

What's wrong with New Haven? It's Bridgeport with Yale.

[jlw1980]

I've never had a real NY bagel.

[YankeeClemens22]

Funny you should mention - I read in the NYPost the other day that they are being forced to shut down.

http://www.nypost.com/seven/12042006...ise_kramer.htm

OMG. That's crazy. I hope they reopen soon.

[DontHateOnNumber2]

I miss New York pizza SOOOOO bad. It was almost all I ever ate (other than White Castle) when I would go to NY. Slices as big as my head....-sigh- I'm hungry now.

[JL25and3]

In most of the country they think bagels are basically just doughnut-shaped bread. In New York, they know better. Real bagels are made with malt syrup, and they have to be boiled before it's baked. And they're best if they're hand-rolled

Bagel Oasis, on the Horace Harding Expressway in Queens, makes truly excellent bagels.

[gamesix1977]

I've never had a real NY bagel.

You are missing out

[Hitman23]

What's wrong with New Haven? It's Bridgeport with Yale.

it was just a good burn. I have no issue with New Haven.

[Octoberbaby]

I've never had a real NY bagel.

You don't know what you are missing!

[Octoberbaby]

Another thing people don't realize is that the air has something to do with baking. Here in L.A. the air is too dry. Humidity helps the dough to rise better. That is why bread in general is not so good here. In Northern Ca. you have the humidity which explains the great sourdough bread there. For pizza the dough has to rise. I am not sure if the dough rises for making bagels or not but it probably does. Also, most places probably don't cook the bagels properly here in L.A. because they taste like bread shaped like a bagel. I used to bring back a couple of dozen bagels and freeze them every time I went to N.Y.

[Barb51850]

A bakery owner in my neighborhood told me it is definitely the water.

[Octoberbaby]

A bakery owner in my neighborhood told me it is definitely the water.

I agree that water has a lot to do with it too. I know we have hard water in L.A. In Las Vegas where my father lives the water is even harder. I am sure this makes a big difference.