Allen Iverson retires from the NBA [Archive]

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 07:10 PM

Would love to have seen him wear a Knick unifrom, just for the fact that he is so damn exciting to watch and gives 100 % every game and is the most fearless player I have ever witnessed.

Yep. All I know is if I were the Cavs GM....I would have signed this guy the minute he cleared waivers. AI on that team makes them better and gives them a better chance at a title. LeBron cant do it all--we saw what happened in the playoffs last year....that team lacks a second scorer--someone who can create his own shot and take some of the pressure off James.

This goes for many teams. They can all use Iverson. Yet for some reason the GM's colluded and decided to blackball this guy. Ridiculous.

b_joseph

11-25-09, 08:05 PM

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:24 PM

He gets blackballed because he doesnt understand team. He still thinks its 2001 and he can go out there, throw up 30 shots and take a team forward in a pathetic conference.

Iverson wants the spotlight and wont take a back seat to anyone. Putting him on the Cavs would just make them easier to beat.

He's always had to be a one-man team. Good grief....look at those Sixers teams he played on. Look what the guy had to play with? Look at the 2001 team that faced your Lakers in the Finals....McKie, Eric Snow, Tyrone Hill, Ratliff, Mutombo, Jumaine Jones, Matt Geiger etc etc.....these guys were all role players. Where's the guy that could step up, take some off the heat off AI, create his own offense? Mutombo's offensive game was limited, he wasnt a guy you could just throw the ball down low and let him score on his own...his points came off putbacks or easy layups/dunks due to someone driving and drawing people away from the basket leaving him open. The guy had to take 25 shots a game and score 30+ a night. Its a miracle that team ever made the Finals and a miracle they actually won a game off LA...cuz that 2001 LA team was crazy good. It was only cuz Iverson had that amazing Game 1 that they did take a game.

IMO if you put him on a team with another superstar like LeBron he would be fine.

Joba-Walkee

11-25-09, 08:25 PM

Sad to see a guy retire when he alot of good basketball left in him. Screw these GM's who wont sign him and add him to their team. Stupid.
Screw the guy for refusing to come off the bench.

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:26 PM

Screw the guy for refusing to come off the bench.

He shouldnt be coming off the bench. He can still start. I dont get this idea that the guy is all of a sudden finished.

Joba-Walkee

11-25-09, 08:27 PM

He shouldnt be coming off the bench. He can still start. I dont get this idea that the guy is all of a sudden finished.
He won't be starting on a good team, and he sure as hell should not be starting on a young team.

He's an old basketball player who relied on endurance and blinding speed. He doesn't have those attributes anymore, at least not in the amount he had them before. Athletes like that fall quickly.

Besides, he's vastly inefficient, and plays terrible defense. His MPG are almost as high as his FG%!

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:28 PM

He won't be starting on a good team, and he sure as hell should not be starting on a young team.

He's two years away from averaging over 26 a game. He averaged over 17 a night in limited minutes last year. The guy has alot of good basketball left in him.

Joba-Walkee

11-25-09, 08:30 PM

He's two years away from averaging over 26 a game. He averaged over 17 a night in limited minutes last year. The guy has alot of good basketball left in him.
17 points on 41.6 % from the field, in 36 minutes. Hardly starting quality when he doesn't bring anything else to the guard position and may retard growth. Plus, he's proven to be volatile.

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:33 PM

17 points on 41.6 % from the field, in 36 minutes. Hardly starting quality when he doesn't bring anything else to the guard position and may retard growth.

What growth? In terms of the Knicks, he'd take away minutes from scrubs like Hughes and Duhon. Cleveland isnt gonna get over the hump until they find a 2nd guy who can create his own offense and score 20+ a game, without having to be setup by James.

DontHateOnNumber2

11-25-09, 08:34 PM

This guy had been my favorite basketball player from years, based solely on skill not his attitude. I came home and turned on ESPN News to see it. I couldn't believe it. The man can still play, assuming his back isn't still shot, and I'd like to see him get on a contending team and win a ring but that's unlikely to happen. I've seen the guy do lots of amazing things over the years, but I just can't believe the guy is quitting due to being relegated to the bench. In my opinion, had he been patient he would've ended up starting regardless. I didn't mind his sneakers either (but only from The Question to the Answer 6).

Joba-Walkee

11-25-09, 08:35 PM

What growth? In terms of the Knicks, he'd take away minutes from scrubs like Hughes and Duhon. Cleveland isnt gonna get over the hump until they find a 2nd guy who can create his own offense and score 20+ a game, without having to be setup by James.
Delonte West is a far superior player to Allen Iverson, and a much better fit for the starting lineup. AI would be nice off the bench in Cleveland. Too bad he's nto willing to do that.

It's the Knicks.

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:37 PM

Delonte West is a far superior player to Allen Iverson.

It's the Knicks.

What?? You cannot give the ball to West in crunch time....when LeBron either needs a blow or is doubled....and say "hey create your own shot and get us points here". He will never be someone who will score 20+ a game and be a 2nd dominant scorer on a title team. He's a role player who hits spot up 3's created by James....and someone who can get to the basket every now and then.

b_joseph

11-25-09, 08:40 PM

He's always had to be a one-man team. Good grief....look at those Sixers teams he played on. Look what the guy had to play with? Look at the 2001 team that faced your Lakers in the Finals....McKie, Eric Snow, Tyrone Hill, Ratliff, Mutombo, Jumaine Jones, Matt Geiger etc etc.....these guys were all role players. Where's the guy that could step up, take some off the heat off AI, create his own offense? Mutombo's offensive game was limited, he wasnt a guy you could just throw the ball down low and let him score on his own...his points came off putbacks or easy layups/dunks due to someone driving and drawing people away from the basket leaving him open. The guy had to take 25 shots a game and score 30+ a night. Its a miracle that team ever made the Finals and a miracle they actually won a game off LA...cuz that 2001 LA team was crazy good. It was only cuz Iverson had that amazing Game 1 that they did take a game.

IMO if you put him on a team with another superstar like LeBron he would be fine.I didnt say that he didnt have to be a one man team, I said that he still thinks like he is that player. The player who can throw up 30 shots and do it night after night. He cant be that player anymore and he never came to terms with it. If he came to terms with that fact, he would be a 6th man for a title contender and that team would be laughing.

He played with another superstar in Carmelo..look what happened there. Melo is one of the best post up players in the league, he can get anyone an open shot. But Iverson couldnt deal with it..Denver traded him and found themselves in the WCF.

Learn some humilty..come off the bench for a bad team..show you can lead without having to be the #1...get traded to a contender by deadline..be happy. Its not a hard thing to do.
But no, he thinks he is still elite and it led to early retirement.

DontHateOnNumber2

11-25-09, 08:41 PM

Besides, he's vastly inefficient, and plays terrible defense. His MPG are almost as high as his FG%!

I recall him being among the league leaders in steals for about 6 straight years. I guess that doesn't count for much. That Iverson....what a scrub.

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:43 PM

I didnt say that he didnt have to be a one man team, I said that he still thinks like he is that player. The player who can throw up 30 shots and do it night after night.

He cant be that player anymore and he never came to terms with it. If he came to terms with that fact, he would be a 6th man for a title contender and that team would be laughing.

He played with another superstar in Carmelo..look what happened there.

That was more about being in a deep conference running into better teams in the playoffs...Spurs in 07 and LA in 08.

Joba-Walkee

11-25-09, 08:44 PM

What?? You cannot give the ball to West in crunch time....when LeBron either needs a blow or is doubled....and say "hey create your own shot and get us points here". He will never be someone who will score 20+ a game and be a 2nd dominant scorer on a title team. He's a role player who hits spot up 3's created by James....and someone who can get to the basket every now and then.
If you're giving the ball to AI in crunch time when you have LeBron on the floor, you're crazy. You're much better off giving the ball to LeBron, and surrounding him with shooters to stretch the floor. The only time AI would be needed would be when LeBron is OFF the floor.

West is a great defender. AI is garbage.

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:44 PM

I recall him being among the league leaders in steals for about 6 straight years. I guess that doesn't count for much. That Iverson....what a scrub.

Iverson will be maybe the most underappreciated superstar of this era when all is said and done. He is one of those guys that people will remember the negatives (practice!?!), his image (cornrows, tats etc.) then what he did on the court.

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:45 PM

If you're giving the ball to AI in crunch time when you have LeBron on the floor, you're crazy. You're much better off giving the ball to LeBron, and surrounding him with shooters to stretch the floor. The only time AI would be needed would be when LeBron is OFF the floor.

West is a great defender. AI is garbage.

How did that work for Cleveland last year? When they had nobody to step up and help LeBron carry the offense?

Joba-Walkee

11-25-09, 08:45 PM

I recall him being among the league leaders in steals for about 6 straight years. I guess that doesn't count for much. That Iverson....what a scrub.
You're right, it doesn't count for much.

Joba-Walkee

11-25-09, 08:46 PM

How did that work for Cleveland last year? When they had nobody to step up and help LeBron carry the offense?
They were 4th in offensive rating. So yeah, it worked well.

b_joseph

11-25-09, 08:46 PM

That was more about being in a deep conference running into better teams in the playoffs...Spurs in 07 and LA in 08.But with the same team, Billups took them to the WCF.

Refusing to come off the bench in Detroit..those things rub people the wrong way. Sacrifice yourself for the team.

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:47 PM

They were 4th in offensive rating. So yeah, it worked well.

Im talking about the playoffs. When they ran into a well-rounded team like Orlando that had several offensive options and didnt only have one scorer.

Joba-Walkee

11-25-09, 08:48 PM

Im talking about the playoffs. When they ran into a well-rounded team like Orlando that had several offensive options and didnt only have one scorer.
They lost to a great team they matched up poorly against. AI does not win them that series.

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:48 PM

But with the same team, Billups took them to the WCF.

They won 4 more games last season. The conference also wasnt as deep as in previous years. New Orleans, Dallas, San Antonio, Houston werent as good as in previous seasons.

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:49 PM

They lost to a great team they matched up poorly against. AI does not win them that series.

If they had a second scoring option that could get to the basket and create his own offense....they win that series.

DontHateOnNumber2

11-25-09, 08:50 PM

Iverson will be maybe the most underappreciated superstar of this era when all is said and done. He is one of those guys that people will remember the negatives (practice!?!), his image (cornrows, tats etc.) then what he did on the court.

Trust me, I know. Kevin Garnett is also a former league MVP (one of my favorite players to watch) who plays hard, but has a similar bad attitude. I've lost count of how many stories I've heard of him getting into altercations with teammates, and even fighting during practice (I'm talking about PRACTICE. Yeah, that doesn't get old. Plus I think he was rocking a Red Sox hat. Douchery was to be expected.), and yet he's praised for his passion. He went and won a ring and he's still "The Kid." His negatives aren't blown up like Iverson's were, and that's just because he wasn't as entertaining for reporters.

Joba-Walkee

11-25-09, 08:52 PM

If they had a second scoring option that could get to the basket and create his own offense....they win that series.
Why does he need to create his own offense with LeBron on the court? Why is that a big enough difference to win them the series?

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:52 PM

Trust me, I know. Kevin Garnett is also a former league MVP (one of my favorite players to watch) who plays hard, but has a similar bad attitude. I've lost count of how many stories I've heard of him getting into altercations with teammates, and even fighting during practice (I'm talking about PRACTICE. Yeah, that doesn't get old. Plus I think he was rocking a Red Sox hat. Douchery was to be expected.), and yet he's praised for his passion. He went and won a ring and he's still "The Kid." His negatives aren't blown up like Iverson's were, and that's just because he wasn't as entertaining for reporters.

I think my appreciation for Iverson grew alot during the 2004 Olympics. While the coach and the rest of that team (including Melo and LeBron) were to busy whining and embarassing themselves....there was Iverson playing 100% every game, leaving his heart on the floor and seemingly the only player on that team that gave a damn.

b_joseph

11-25-09, 08:52 PM

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:53 PM

Why does he need to create his own offense with LeBron on the court? Why is that a big enough difference to win them the series?

What team recently has won a title with only one dominant superstar/one dominant scorer? Excluding the 2004 Pistons.

Joba-Walkee

11-25-09, 08:54 PM

What team recently has won a title with only one dominant superstar/one dominant scorer? Excluding the 2004 Pistons.
AI isn't a dominant scorer any more.

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:55 PM

Lets put it this way. Ron Artest is openly described as a crazy person, yet every team in the league wants him..Rasheed Wallace the same, every team in the league wants him.
What does that say for Iversons personality and ability to work within a team structure?

Wallace is a role player. Last time we saw him be "the man" on a team, he was missing shots and watching his team choke away a 15 point lead in Game 7 of a conference finals.

Lets see how LA does this year w/Artest.

b_joseph

11-25-09, 08:55 PM

Trust me, I know. Kevin Garnett is also a former league MVP (one of my favorite players to watch) who plays hard, but has a similar bad attitude. I've lost count of how many stories I've heard of him getting into altercations with teammates, and even fighting during practice (I'm talking about PRACTICE. Yeah, that doesn't get old. Plus I think he was rocking a Red Sox hat. Douchery was to be expected.), and yet he's praised for his passion. He went and won a ring and he's still "The Kid." His negatives aren't blown up like Iverson's were, and that's just because he wasn't as entertaining for reporters.Garnett was altercations come from a desire to win though.
Garnett has never been selfish in his pursuit to win, he just pushes everyone around him to elevate their level.

Iverson on the other hand wants to win but wants to be the reaosn for his team winning. Thats all well and good when you are young but as you age, that cant be.

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:55 PM

AI isn't a dominant scorer any more.

He can get 20 a game and can create his own offense. Thats what the Cavs need. Him or someone else like him.

b_joseph

11-25-09, 08:56 PM

Wallace is a role player. Last time we saw him be "the man" on a team, he was missing shots and watching his team choke away a 15 point lead in Game 7 of a conference finals.

Lets see how LA does this year w/Artest.Wallace is a role player and Iverson is also. Any good team he moves to, he would be the 3rd best/most important player. Thats a role player.
Its not just about stats, this isnt a computer game. Players have to mesh together, to sacrifice themselves for each other..Iverson has never done that. Why risk him messing up your team??

LA will be fine thank you :)

Joba-Walkee

11-25-09, 08:58 PM

He can get 20 a game and can create his own offense. Thats what the Cavs need. Him or someone else like him.
They need an efficient scorer who can create his own offense. AI is not that.

dabomb2045

11-25-09, 08:59 PM

Wallace is a role player and Iverson is also. Any good team he moves to, he would be the 3rd best/most important player. Thats a role player.
Its not just about stats, this isnt a computer game. Players have to mesh together, to sacrifice themselves for each other..Iverson has never done that. Why risk him messing up your team??

LA will be fine thank you :)

Cuz in Cleveland's case....they need to try it cuz the team they have constituted right now is not winning a championship. They dont have the talent surrounding James to do it. They need to find someone to take some of the offensive burden off James.

Iverson's worth a shot cuz all it costs is a few million.

DontHateOnNumber2

11-25-09, 09:06 PM

Wallace is a role player and Iverson is also. Any good team he moves to, he would be the 3rd best/most important player. Thats a role player.
Its not just about stats, this isnt a computer game. Players have to mesh together, to sacrifice themselves for each other..Iverson has never done that. Why risk him messing up your team??

LA will be fine thank you :)

LA will be more than fine, but it won't be because of Artest. The Lakers are deep as hell this season....regardless, Garnett's desire to win in what's more or less a pickup game during practice didn't warrant him hitting his own teammate.

On another note that 2004(?) Wolves team with Cassell, Sprewell, Garnett, and Co. were one of my favorites to watch. I still can't believe they didn't win it all that season.

b_joseph

11-25-09, 09:07 PM

Cuz in Cleveland's case....they need to try it cuz the team they have constituted right now is not winning a championship. They dont have the talent surrounding James to do it. They need to find someone to take some of the offensive burden off James.

Iverson's worth a shot cuz all it costs is a few million.At this stage..Mo Williams is probably just as effective as Iverson and he is also a much better shooter.

Plus, they wont write him off because he only had one bad series last season. They will feel he deserves a chance to redeem himself. Plus he showed for 90% of last year that he fits like a glove with Lebron.

Shootout!!

b_joseph

11-25-09, 09:08 PM

LA will be more than fine, but it won't be because of Artest. The Lakers are deep as hell this season....regardless, Garnett's desire to win in what's more or less a pickup game during practice didn't warrant him hitting his own teammate.

On another note that 2004(?) Wolves team with Cassell, Spreewell, Garnett, and Co. were one of my favorites to watch. I still can't believe they didn't win it all that season.They were better than us that year but Cassell was hurt and we squeaked by them in the WCF. Very good team.

Jace

11-25-09, 10:52 PM

I agree with the GMs. AI would be a great bench player for Cleveland, sure, but we all know his viewpoint on that

Nobody is debating his incredibly rare and exciting talent, but the goal is to win basketball games in the present, not worship at an altar of 3+ years ago (that still wasn't as good at its peak as Kobe, LeBron, etc). He's a defensive liability similar to Nate Robinson (maybe not that bad... but steals can be like fielding % in baseball, it doesnt count all the times your guy got by you or backed you down and dunked) and he isn't that efficient offensively anymore.

He's not a bad player and could be very useful if he was willing to sacrifice what it took, but he's not someone you want to play huge minutes anymore. Its just the way it is

Jeter Kid

11-25-09, 10:54 PM

The Answer is no longer The Answer.

We talkin' bout practice?

Casey at the Bat

11-26-09, 11:43 AM

Retire Iverson. It would be a fitting final stamp on your amazing career, and amazingly horrible attitude.

I remember a story when AI was with the Sixers, and he was going to try to play through an injury. On the court, before the game, the coach told AI that he would play him off the bench, due to the injury (half a game of AI is better than a whole game with no AI). AI immediately got up, walked to the locker room and got undressed. His reasoning? "I didn't get dressed to come in off the bench." Nice attitude there AI.

It stinks, because he could be a great help to teams off the bench, but he refuses to accept that. Oh well. No one in the NBA seems to be losing any sleep over it but AI.